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View Full Version : Can we see weaknesses in Kenny's tactics?



liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:19
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

Echos
14-8-11, 02:20
of course he is, you're a really uneducated red

BayernBru
14-8-11, 02:23
We're not expecting to win the league neither are we expected to, fourth is our target and if we get a better position along the way, fair enough, your whole first post is flawed.

40Yarder
14-8-11, 02:24
You seem like one of those clueless bandwagon 'fans' who don't have a clue what they're on about yet spout nonsense like it's fact.

Them kind of 'fans' really make me quite annoyed.

And since when did Kenny 'walk out' on us? It was for justified reasons he left this club. Please educate yourself.

bigFATpaulie
14-8-11, 02:28
You seem like one of those clueless bandwagon 'fans' who don't have a clue what they're on about yet spout nonsense like it's fact.

Them kind of 'fans' really make me quite annoyed.

And since when did Kenny 'walk out' on us? It was for justified reasons he left this club. Please educate yourself.

Relax hes a new poster just getting his point across and OP Kenny most defo is the King do not forget that please. (refer for future reference)

Bombay Money Lender
14-8-11, 02:32
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

You had your chance and blew it. Concentrate on the England job.

Kloppstachio
14-8-11, 02:33
I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!

i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.

You were too young to remember the great things Kenny did yet you've been anticipating the starts of 20 seasons....a tad contradictory, no ?

As for the rest of your post I take it that while you watched the 2nd half of today's game, you may have missed some or all of the second half of last season...............

DanJ2
14-8-11, 02:35
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

1) a couple of neutral posts and I was red already, get used to it!

On other points .. . I think the idea of KK failing is just not thinkable to the majority of liverpool supporters, including me. That is why there is so much optimism. Kenny CAN NOT FAIL...what would it mean if he did>>>????

I trust in KK and think he is/will do a great job. Don't let one half of a performance mask that. TBH, we will prob be let down again. The blinkered optimism on these boards can be cringeworthy.... but do not . .. EVER . . I mean EVER...suggest that Kenny is equal/worse that Roy . . .. that is sacrilege and completely ******* ridiculous...

:scarf

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:36
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

40Yarder
14-8-11, 02:36
You had your chance and blew it. Concentrate on the England job.

:D

DanJ2
14-8-11, 02:39
You seem like one of those clueless bandwagon 'fans' who don't have a clue what they're on about yet spout nonsense like it's fact.

Them kind of 'fans' really make me quite annoyed.

And since when did Kenny 'walk out' on us? It was for justified reasons he left this club. Please educate yourself.

Whilst I respect yr post I think yr 'fact' is spurious at best and therefore hypocritical. I'm 'new' to this forum but you can't assume someone 'new' is somehow more limited in LFC history than you, oh esteemed poster :)

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:40
You were too young to remember the great things Kenny did yet you've been anticipating the starts of 20 seasons....a tad contradictory, no ?

As for the rest of your post I take it that while you watched the 2nd half of today's game, you may have missed some or all of the second half of last season...............

I did watch the end of last season, it was great. that kind off thing happens when a new manager comes in. look atwhat roy did at west brom. shorely that was a bigger achievement.

danm77
14-8-11, 02:40
You may be young, but the name and respect the man has should provide some hint to you that Kenny Dalglish was famous for something. Perhaps you should do some research on the man before you start a thread with perhaps the most ridiculous title ever - "Is Kenny Dalglish any better than Roy Hodgson?".

I was 6 when Kenny resigned from Liverpool in 1991, barely old enough to remember anything from his first spell in charge, but that is no excuse to not knowing what the man has achieved.

DanJ2
14-8-11, 02:42
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

Ignore them and stick to yr guns, you dont need to retaliate, yr opinion is as valid as anyone who has bothered get 40k+ posts on this forum IMO

:p

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 02:44
As someone who wasn't even born the last time we won the league, I can confirm that the thread title is the worst I have ever seen, .....

naturalskill
14-8-11, 02:44
I smell toffee:D

DanJ2
14-8-11, 02:46
You may be young, but the name and respect the man has should provide some hint to you that Kenny Dalglish was famous for something. Perhaps you should do some research on the man before you start a thread with perhaps the most ridiculous title ever - "Is Kenny Dalglish any better than Roy Hodgson?".

I was 6 when Kenny resigned from Liverpool in 1991, barely old enough to remember anything from his first spell in charge, but that is no excuse to not knowing what the man has achieved.

I shouldn't really be sticking up for this guy considering I only just starting posting myself but I think what he is saying (erroneously I have to admit in my personal opinion) is that, despite HISTORY is KK the man for LFC . . .I say YES . . .but this guy has prob only seen the recent hurt and now sees a 'legend' that he has no connection with in charge. Yes, he needs to do some research but also LFC fans maybe need to take KK's balls out their mouth and see he is fallible>>????

:)

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:47
You may be young, but the name and respect the man has should provide some hint to you that Kenny Dalglish was famous for something. Perhaps you should do some research on the man before you start a thread with perhaps the most ridiculous title ever - "Is Kenny Dalglish any better than Roy Hodgson?".

I was 6 when Kenny resigned from Liverpool in 1991, barely old enough to remember anything from his first spell in charge, but that is no excuse to not knowing what the man has achieved.

your right kenny is/was the man. I have done my reaserch. unfortunately for liverpool fans including myslef, we live to much in the past. thats why most other fans always laugh at us, and will continue to do so in the future.

Echos
14-8-11, 02:47
we're one of the biggest clubs worldwide, bound to attract a few idiots here and there

Fjubb
14-8-11, 02:49
Kenny is a lot better. Even if we'd start this season as bad as last (which I don't think we will), he'd still be a lot better than Roy. When Kenny gets a bad result, he isn't stupid like Roy and says that the team played well when it didn't. Roy's post Everton press conference last season was the worst thing I have ever witnessed.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:49
I shouldn't really be sticking up for this guy considering I only just starting posting myself but I think what he is saying (erroneously I have to admit in my personal opinion) is that, despite HISTORY is KK the man for LFC . . .I say YES . . .but this guy has prob only seen the recent hurt and now sees a 'legend' that he has no connection with in charge. Yes, he needs to do some research but also LFC fans maybe need to take KK's balls out their mouth and see he is fallible>>????

:)

great reponse, I will continue to do my research as best I can.

Kloppstachio
14-8-11, 02:50
I did watch the end of last season, it was great. that kind off thing happens when a new manager comes in. look atwhat roy did at west brom. shorely that was a bigger achievement.

If you think saving a team from relegation counts as a bigger achievement than pushing a team up sitting below 10th place up to the verge of European football then I guess I have no more to add on this matter.

Welcome to the forum.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:51
we're one of the biggest clubs worldwide, bound to attract a few idiots here and there

you have just proved this with your response. Why not answer some off my valid questions with answers, rather than attack me?

Kloppstachio
14-8-11, 02:52
As someone who wasn't even born the last time we won the league, I can confirm that the thread title is the worst I have ever seen, .....

:eek: You're that young ? Hmm ..on second thoughts I guess I'm that old now ... :FP:

ItsAPenPOff
14-8-11, 02:52
To say Rafa was never good enough for Liverpool is just plain mad! I like a lot of people was very dissappointed with 2009-2010. But he brought us 2 major trophies in 6 years. Yeah it may have been Houllier's team but Houllier wasn't there at halftime in the Attaturk. Nor was he there barking orders in the 90th min when Stevie smashed the ball against the left hand net. You must be related to Liz

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 02:52
Is Kenny Dalglish any better then Roy Hodgson?

At pulling turkey-like faces no.
At playing football, yes in every department you may wish to consider.
At managing Liverpool FC, yes in every department you may wish to consider.

40Yarder
14-8-11, 02:54
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as Kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

Carroll's fee was dictated by factors which were out of our control. For example, we wanted whatever Carroll would cost + £15m for Torres. And that's coming from the big man John Henry's mouth. Stop focusing on the fee, at least we got a new number 9 and one with potential at that, Carroll could become a beast for us.

Henderson cost £16m btw, don't believe all you see on Sky Sports, and for his potential and the fact that he's English that's the average fee you'd expect, seeing as other players like Jones are going for similar prices. Just be glad that we're getting backed up and being allowed to buy the players we want, not like last year where we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for players like Konchesky and Poulsen.

Also, Kuyt and Meireles, two proven first team and international players were brought on, who did you want? Spearing and Doni? Just give the team some time to gel and the results will start rolling in.

I'm sure you love LFC, as we all do. But have some faith instead of sticking it to the players and management after 1 game, can you imagine if we all had your mindset?

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:54
If you think saving a team from relegation counts as a bigger achievement than pushing a team up sitting below 10th place up to the verge of European football then I guess I have no more to add on this matter.

Welcome to the forum.

i thinks its at least equal. look at the players both managers had. loook at how tight the relegation batlle was. I do believe if suarez hadn't have started on fire last season, more people would be asking the same questions.

-CADS-
14-8-11, 02:55
Is Reina any better than Itandje?

DanJ2
14-8-11, 02:56
If you think saving a team from relegation counts as a bigger achievement than pushing a team up sitting below 10th place up to the verge of European football then I guess I have no more to add on this matter.

Welcome to the forum.

Again I don't think this is fair. RH was clueless for us but did amazingly for WBA after he left. Pure coincidence? I think not. Football is about making a team play to their potential. RH wasn't able to do that at LFC but was at WBA . . . .it's as big achievement eityher way, football isn't just about sitting in the top 4 you know...

Kloppstachio
14-8-11, 02:56
I smell toffee:D

With a hint of "Bitter" flavor. ;)

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 02:56
To say Rafa was never good enough for Liverpool is just plain mad! I like a lot of people was very dissappointed with 2009-2010. But he brought us 2 major trophies in 6 years. Yeah it may have been Houllier's team but Houllier wasn't there at halftime in the Attaturk. Nor was he there barking orders in the 90th min when Stevie smashed the ball against the left hand net. You must be related to Liz

I never said I wanted rafa out (i wish he was still in charge) just going of the abuse he used to cop on these forums.

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 02:58
Is having £10 better than having £0?
Is Oxford a real place?
Is got a word?

ItsAPenPOff
14-8-11, 02:58
Is Reina any better than Itandje?

Not at having a laugh at the Hillsborough memorial! What a ****!

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 02:59
Is Reina any better than Itandje?

Yes.

jamiechloe
14-8-11, 03:00
I smell toffee:D

Mmmm, I always question why someone would read these forums for 4 years but never post until now

DanJ2
14-8-11, 03:01
Is having £10 better than having £0?
Is Oxford a real place?
Is got a word?

Yes
Yes
Yes - it's the past simple of 'to get'. If you wanna argue more about that hit me up and I'll crucify you :)

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 03:02
Mmmm, I always question why someone would read these forums for 4 years but never post until now

You've obviously never heard of sleepers...

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 03:03
Yes
Yes
Yes - it's the past simple of 'to get'. If you wanna argue more about that hit me up and I'll crucify you :)

If I were you (subjunctive) I'd stay down.

hsf
14-8-11, 03:04
The one thing that does annoy me on a scale which if it was measured on a richter scale would bring cities crashing down, is the fact that Kenny is untouchable. He is human guys, he's prone to mistakes like the rest of us, so don't expect him to be perfect, don't expect him to have a 100% success record and please, don't expect him to bring the PL trophy back home where it belongs this season.

I'm not saying he won't do all of that, I'm just saying expectation is a heavy burden to carry.

Kloppstachio
14-8-11, 03:06
Again I don't think this is fair. RH was clueless for us but did amazingly for WBA after he left. Pure coincidence? I think not. Football is about making a team play to their potential. RH wasn't able to do that at LFC but was at WBA . . . .it's as big achievement eityher way, football isn't just about sitting in the top 4 you know...

I wish RH well at WBA and I'm not interested in attacking him here. He did well at WBA and saved them from almost defo relegation. But the results of what Kenny achieved compared to Hodgson with the exact same squad speaks for itself.

widden
14-8-11, 03:07
:confused::mad::FP::eek::(:sleepy::

jamiechloe
14-8-11, 03:10
You've obviously never heard of sleepers...

Which are???

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 03:14
Which are???

Big wooden things that are used on railways.

Or blue nosed spies sent to infiltrate us having 'slept' on the boards.

Can't remember which I meant.

InsomniacOlympics
14-8-11, 03:16
This thread is dangerous.

Echos
14-8-11, 03:17
Big wooden things that are used on railways.

Or blue nosed spys sent to infiltrate us having 'slept' on the boards.

Can't remember which I meant.

i think it's also a movie

Snippes
14-8-11, 03:17
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

Sad thing is - you make some valid question points on how much we paid for Henderson and the team needing a creative player like Aqua.

But all of it is lost in the incredibly moronically shocking exercise of comparing the most successful individual in this history of this club - to a less than nobody entity like Roy Hodgson. I don't care if you were born yesterday, you sound like a complete idiot even asking that question. It undermines everything else you might have to say - and I find myself wishing you would have just stuck with that voyeur status you had for 4 years.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 03:18
Carroll's fee was dictated by factors which were out of our control. For example, we wanted whatever Carroll would cost + £15m for Torres. And that's coming from the big man John Henry's mouth. Stop focusing on the fee, at least we got a new number 9 and one with potential at that, Carroll could become a beast for us.

Henderson cost £16m btw, don't believe all you see on Sky Sports, and for his potential and the fact that he's English that's the average fee you'd expect, seeing as other players like Jones are going for similar prices. Just be glad that we're getting backed up and being allowed to buy the players we want, not like last year where we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for players like Konchesky and Poulsen.

Also, Kuyt and Meireles, two proven first team and international players were brought on, who did you want? Spearing and Doni? Just give the team some time to gel and the results will start rolling in.

I'm sure you love LFC, as we all do. But have some faith instead of sticking it to the players and management after 1 game, can you imagine if we all had your mindset?

thanks for your educted reponse, i do apprecitate it, instead of just being attacked. you ask who we should have come on, how about aqua ngog. (lets win the game) ok maybe not ngog.

andy602
14-8-11, 03:18
Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

I do agree on this bit.

Echos
14-8-11, 03:20
I do agree on this bit.

nobody is worth the prices they're going for, but that's the market these days, especially when it comes to young english talent

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 03:21
Sad thing is - you make some valid question points on how much we paid for Henderson and the team needing a creative player like Aqua.

But all of it is lost in the incredibly moronically shocking exercise of comparing the most successful individual in this history of this club - to a less than nobody entity like Roy Hodgson. I don't care if you were born yesterday, you sound like a complete idiot even asking that question. It undermines everything else you might have to say - and I find myself wishing you would have just stuck with that voyeur status you had for 4 years.

so should I change the tittle, is that what your trying to say. i dont for one second think roy has the history that king kenny has, but what I saw yesterday in the second half was rubbish, and I do think im allowed to question some off the players brought in by the king.

DanJ2
14-8-11, 03:22
Old Today, 03:08
DanJ2
This message has been deleted by Jannno. Reason: dear me

Janno sorry, excuse my ignorance but what got banned here . .. can't find a way to PM you and I don't want to post anything offensive but I wanna be a part of these forums... any way you could let me know??? :)

Belfast-Connect
14-8-11, 03:23
the OP's getting a bashing and he probably deserves it for the stupid thread title but he makes a few decent points, albeit a few stupid ones as well

In summary

In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson. - that's just stupid - rafa was boss for many years and lost it, when the owners (and it was the owners) lost the dressing room for him

is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc - that's just stupid - no need for an answer


35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player- difficult to say what carroll would have fetched in a summer market with a year left on his contract - but that wasn't the position - special circumstances pertained - if anyone is questionable there it's comolli not kenny and torres paid for carroll not the club, or kenny

20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player
- i find it difficult to justify the fee we spent on henderson - i'm still not clear exactly what he does - i envisage him doing pretty much what shelvey did the back end of last season - at least when gerrard comes back - 16million (not 20) was a lot of money for him and I remain to be convinced


his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well.
- matter of opinion, but carry on

Why start with all our new players on the park. was a bit concerned about that myself - to be fair it didn't seem to affect us in the first half when we were pretty rampant though, but if your'e going to play henderson there (which I didn't agree with in the first place) then kuyt should've come on much earlier to combat the energy of their midfield in the 2nd half. I got negged for saying this when the team was announced but I do hope kenny isn't going to be stubbornly picking his signings when guys who have shown their a good fit for the team (e.g. mereiles, kuyt) are not being played - starting henderson today in front of either of those two made me wonder about that

(and I know that they both probably played midweek, maybe might not be match fit, etc. etc. etc. - but it's a point of view)

Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. we were playing a steve bruce side - we were in for a physical battle - henderson is 6 ft but he's quite slight really - henderson and flannagan on the right side was a bit optimistic in my view


in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. we lack a replacement for suarez, i.e. a player who can find space, to a trick or place a pass no-one else thinks about - when suarez came off aqua might not have been a bad option; then again there may well be other things going on behind the scenes

what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo made sense to me - midfield were looking leggy and kuyt would provide legs if nothing else

then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him? well he didn't use him because he wasn't on the bench but I think maybe he could've been

Jannno
14-8-11, 03:24
Janno sorry, excuse my ignorance but what got banned here . .. can't find a way to PM you and I don't want to post anything offensive but I wanna be a part of these forums... any way you could let me know??? :)

Nobody banned, but overtly vulgar sexual remarks like that will always get deleted. No infraction points for a first offence :)

Jannno
14-8-11, 03:26
Liverpoolsurfer I think you've argued your stance, and credit to people for not going off the deep end for a more-than-faintly-provocative thread title!

Would you like me to amend the title?

40Yarder
14-8-11, 03:27
thanks for your educted reponse, i do apprecitate it, instead of just being attacked. you ask who we should have come on, how about aqua ngog. (lets win the game) ok maybe not ngog.

Aquilani wasn't on the bench.

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 03:29
i think it's also a movie

I think you're right.

coachwatson
14-8-11, 03:29
Aquilani wasn't on the bench.


I don't think this point hurts the OP's assertions

DanJ2
14-8-11, 03:31
Nobody banned, but overtly vulgar sexual remarks like that will always get deleted. No infraction points for a first offence :)

Was all true though! :D

DanJ2
14-8-11, 03:33
Aquilani wasn't on the bench.

If AA had been on the bench the whloe shape of the team could have been changed and *possibly* the second half dross could have been shifted. As it was, Kuyt came on (did a good job) Meir came on (changed nothing) but we were still trying to do the same thing...

Fleems
14-8-11, 03:35
This thread makes me one to stick knitting needles in my eyes and kick adorable puppies.

Snippes
14-8-11, 03:35
so should I change the tittle, is that what your trying to say. i dont for one second think roy has the history that king kenny has, but what I saw yesterday in the second half was rubbish, and I do think im allowed to question some off the players brought in by the king.

Actually, yes, amending the title of the thread would be a great start, mate. Like I said - it undermines any argument you make from there on out when you put Roy and Kenny in the same sentence.

You will not find a bigger fan of Kenny Dalglish than me. If you indeed read this forum for 4 years, you couldn't have missed the 7000 post battles I had with several members of this forum who I told Kenny was the man, the only man for this job after Rafa left.

Yet even I think its totally valid to question Kenny. I personally questioned the selections of young Flanno who, poor kid is taking a ridiculous amount of flack today. I also still wonder what the deal is with Jordan. I firmly question the decision to have Aqua nowhere near this team. FFS - the guy has been our best player this summer and has come out and said - just show me some love and I will stay here and fight for this shirt.

So we reward him by asking him to watch the game at home for some efed up reason. There is no question that Kenny bottled a few decisions today. I still love him and trust him implicitly, good or bad decisions. I am just not going to stand for anyone asking if he was better than Roy. That's like asking if medicine is better than a bullet to the head. Seriously, what kinda question is that?

DanJ2
14-8-11, 03:41
Actually, yes, amending the title of the thread would be a great start, mate. Like I said - it undermines any argument you make from there on out when you put Roy and Kenny in the same sentence.

You will not find a bigger fan of Kenny Dalglish than me. If you indeed read this forum for 4 years, you couldn't have missed the 7000 post battles I had with several members of this forum who I told Kenny was the man, the only man for this job after Rafa left.

Yet even I think its totally valid to question Kenny. I personally questioned the selections of young Flanno who, poor kid is taking a ridiculous amount of flack today. I also still wonder what the deal is with Jordan. I firmly question the decision to have Aqua nowhere near this team. FFS - the guy has been our best player this summer and has come out and said - just show me some love and I will stay here and fight for this shirt.

So we reward him by asking him to watch the game at home for some efed up reason. There is no question that Kenny bottled a few decisions today. I still love him and trust him implicitly, good or bad decisions. I am just not going to stand for anyone asking if he was better than Roy. That's like asking if medicine is better than a bullet to the head. Seriously, what kinda question is that?

So surely yr argument is mute considering Hodgson was the best man (long term) for the job?























;)

phuzz
14-8-11, 03:45
OP needs to remember the Hodgson days a bit more vividly. What a load of complete tosh.

PaintItRed
14-8-11, 03:48
"what was that goal Fowler scored but didn't?"

:p

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 03:56
Liverpoolsurfer I think you've argued your stance, and credit to people for not going off the deep end for a more-than-faintly-provocative thread title!

Would you like me to amend the title?

Sorry about that, yes please.

Jannno
14-8-11, 03:59
Sorry about that, yes please.

No apology necessary :)

Jean-Ralphio
14-8-11, 04:01
Glad I stayed off the football forum today... :confused:

MiroTheRed
14-8-11, 04:09
Janno you might as well delete the thread mate because its pointless and not needed..

The OP is an idiot and has everyright to be called what i called him,

No Angel
14-8-11, 04:15
Not going to neg nor shoot you down mate,but this is one game and ive said it before,Sunderland have also spent heavily and are quite a good side make no mistake,i believe Carrolls goal was legit and we hammered at them for 35/40 mins.We were very unfortunate not to be up 2/3 before the half,that said im also hurtin but im fully confident in Kenny and would certainly not want any other in charge.

You do not even need to see what he did 20yrs ago all you need do is look at the second half of last season,what he did for us,were his tactics against Chelsea not perfect?They were indeed.

LucasTheRed
14-8-11, 04:16
i hate this place when we fail to win a game. ******* depressing.

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 04:21
i hate this place when we fail to win a game. ******* depressing.

I hate it when we don't win.

redjitsu
14-8-11, 04:42
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

Walk out? how dare you even think about putting a statement like that to paper, after what he went through with Hillsborough and family problems .
I am speechless at such a crass comment. :mad:

LukasBrodolski
14-8-11, 04:45
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

Ill arrange a visit with her to see if you're telling the truth or not. Pass me on her number and a list of her most intimate details

NOW!! :mad::mad::mad:

tracetherain
14-8-11, 05:00
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

Basing such a strong opinion off of one match, and in particular the first match of the season, might be an example of being clueless

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 05:02
As a newer fan myself, I don't know anyone before Rafa really. I've watched a lot of old clips, interviews and even read Kenny's book (which is pretty good)
and sometimes it seems like the tradition of the club is all people want to talk about, especially when things go bad, like they have in the recent past.
I, like many on here had some questions about the team selection today, even more so about a few missing players, but mostly about why we just hoofed it forward and forgot how to pass in the second half. It is probably not all Kenny's fault, and if we know anything from last season, its that he'll make them play right one way or another.
I think the pre-season was baffling to us all, and it didn't bode well when we saw so many mish-mash teams of players who never really played together come today.
That being said, from reading his book and hearing him talk about managing and the game itself, I think, in fact I know he is the right man for the job.
He has been able to get the best out of players most thought beyond help, and he will turn the overpriced Carroll into a gem, hopefully not by rolling him around in a barrel for a couple weeks, but by instilling a die hard work ethic into him, into all the players, giving them that same confidence whiskey nose does to the mancs, but without the bad breath.
I hope that answers your question, at least somewhat.
Welcome to the boards, I won't neg you unless you say something completely stupid btw, I've earned the negs I've gotten in the past for the most part. If you don't want to sit in the red, don't post stuff like this after even a draw. Although your comment about him walking out on the club does need some researching. I recommend you buy his book and you will find out why he left like he did.
Don't let those posters with 10,000+ posts fool you, they get ****y just like everyone else sometimes.
As for those who name call and drop negs on anything they don't like, quit being dicks. The poster has a right to his opinion and to be fair, was asking a question.
As for tradition, there is nothing wrong with tradition, without that I wouldn't even know who the hell LFC were. Neither would the millions of fans around the world. Tradition is what brought Suarez here and kept Gerrard.
Quit being nasty to one another. :(
YNWA

AussieT
14-8-11, 05:12
My 2 cents worth is this.

Under the last 1-2 seasons with Rafa, Hodgson's mare and for a short period under Kenny although it got heaps better every team we come up against know 2 things.

1. If we get closed down hard, we lack alot of the technical skill required to move the ball. We lost that when Alonso went and have never got it back.

2. If you close down carra hard he WILL hoof no question. Additionally, carra takes far to long to move the ball. He takes 3-4-5 step just to pass it to the right back. Lucas takes to long aswell

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 05:15
Kenny is a lot better. Even if we'd start this season as bad as last (which I don't think we will), he'd still be a lot better than Roy. When Kenny gets a bad result, he isn't stupid like Roy and says that the team played well when it didn't. Roy's post Everton press conference last season was the worst thing I have ever witnessed.

Agreed.

LukasBrodolski
14-8-11, 05:18
Kenny is a lot better. Even if we'd start this season as bad as last (which I don't think we will), he'd still be a lot better than Roy. When Kenny gets a bad result, he isn't stupid like Roy and says that the team played well when it didn't. Roy's post Everton press conference last season was the worst thing I have ever witnessed.

QPR lost 4-0 and Warnock thought they played very well and were on top for large parts of the game

Hes defo after Roys title :scarf

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 05:19
Again I don't think this is fair. RH was clueless for us but did amazingly for WBA after he left. Pure coincidence? I think not. Football is about making a team play to their potential. RH wasn't able to do that at LFC but was at WBA . . . .it's as big achievement eityher way, football isn't just about sitting in the top 4 you know...

It is when you're Liverpool FC. :scarf:scarf:scarf:scarf

Parrant
14-8-11, 05:19
Lets examine the facts

First Half
Excellent
Suarez - excellent, despite the missed penalty
Carroll - very good, needs to keep his hands down though
Downing - excellent and very unlucky
Adam - excellent
Enrique - great game in both halves

Second Half
Poor
Sunderland worked out their game plan and we played flat.

Dalglish did exactly the right thing and used all his big new signings. In retrospect Aqua man may have been a better choice than Hendo because hendo didnt play well...but Kenny didnt know that when he picked the team...but you cannot knock Kenny for using his new buys.


Give Sunderland some credit...they will do well this season...and at least a beach ball didnt beat us.

The signs are still good for the season....Top 4 is the main priority but we can still challenge for the premiership.

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 05:26
Lets examine the facts

First Half
Excellent
Suarez - excellent, despite the missed penalty
Carroll - very good, needs to keep his hands down though
Downing - excellent and very unlucky
Adam - excellent

Second Half
Poor
Sunderland worked out their game plan and we played flat.

Dalglish did exactly the right thing and used all his big new signings. In retrospect Aqua man may have been a better choice than Hendo...but you cannot knock Kenny for using his new buys.

Give Sunderland some credit...they will do well this season...and at least a beach ball didnt beat us.

The signs are still good for the season....Top 4 is the main priority but we can still challenge for the premiership.

I don't buy the "well you have to play the guys you spent all the money on" theory, but you are right about all the rest of it, in my opinion. I was actually pretty psyched when I saw Kenny's teamsheet for the first time, and it might have worked out if we hadn't got so deflated in the second half.
I'm putting it down to match fitness, but I am concerned that maybe Kenny didn't do the pre-season right to get these players up to full fitness. Most other big clubs were playing their first teamers a lot and as a cohesive unit. The Galatasaray game it seemed was just a throwaway.
Although from watching even Arsenal and Newcastle, they tired a lot in the second half too. Maybe its something in the water around Sunderland.
Also, how could you have forgotten about Enrique?! :eek:

Parrant
14-8-11, 05:30
Good comments JSterling
Yes I forgot about Enrique...I was surprised Kenny played him after only being signed on what friday...he had a great game both halves. Have corrected my OP on this.

Destry
14-8-11, 05:30
Actually, yes, amending the title of the thread would be a great start, mate. Like I said - it undermines any argument you make from there on out when you put Roy and Kenny in the same sentence.

You will not find a bigger fan of Kenny Dalglish than me. If you indeed read this forum for 4 years, you couldn't have missed the 7000 post battles I had with several members of this forum who I told Kenny was the man, the only man for this job after Rafa left.

Yet even I think its totally valid to question Kenny. I personally questioned the selections of young Flanno who, poor kid is taking a ridiculous amount of flack today. I also still wonder what the deal is with Jordan. I firmly question the decision to have Aqua nowhere near this team. FFS - the guy has been our best player this summer and has come out and said - just show me some love and I will stay here and fight for this shirt.

So we reward him by asking him to watch the game at home for some efed up reason. There is no question that Kenny bottled a few decisions today. I still love him and trust him implicitly, good or bad decisions. I am just not going to stand for anyone asking if he was better than Roy. That's like asking if medicine is better than a bullet to the head. Seriously, what kinda question is that?

I was going to post a long response but this says it all in every point. The support for Kenny we all feel but also the realization and acknowledgement that yesterday's match may not have been his finest hour.

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 05:32
Is having £10 better than having £0?
Is Oxford a real place?
Is got a word?

I have a better question which cannot be answered by those in the northeast.

Is New England a place?

KeemI
14-8-11, 05:36
My God! :FP:

coachwatson
14-8-11, 06:17
My 2 cents worth is this.

1. If we get closed down hard, we lack alot of the technical skill required to move the ball. We lost that when Alonso went and have never got it back.



Aquilani has that ability yet we play Adam who doesn't have that ability.

Ihaveadream
14-8-11, 06:27
of course we can debate things, question kenny even, no problem with that.

I will say this though,

If you did not see the player we have bought in carroll then sorry you just do not like the lad.

Class, the man will be a world class number 9 and 35m will look money well spent.

A great buy imho.

Hendo, was a but quiet to be honest but was never going to do anymore than do the simple thing against his old club.

my one gripe and one question, is why does kenny play raul on the left???

He could have put adam out there and leave raul in the centre, this is the kind of decision that Roy would have got shouted at no end.

So lets see how long it takes before the reds have a dig at there own legend.

That apart i thought the first half was class and had me thinking we can win the league this year. But then second half was back to the old ways, so who knows?
Top 4 will do.

One other thing, Adam looks ok and has a lot who love him already.
But for me it will be him that misses out when gerrard is back.

coachwatson
14-8-11, 06:32
o
If you did not see the player we have bought in carroll then sorry you just do not like the lad.

Class, the man will be a world class number 9 and 35m will look money well spent.



Couldn't agree more. If he turns into a bust it will be because his teammates did not learn how to use him effectively. It won't be because of his ability.

old-school
14-8-11, 06:34
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?

windup merchant. You sign up to these forums when you support another club. You're a joke....get a life .......

Ihaveadream
14-8-11, 06:36
windup merchant. You sign up to these forums when you support another club. You're a joke....get a life ......

your up early old school i didn't realise you had a sunday paper round as well.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 06:41
Mmmm, I always question why someone would read these forums for 4 years but never post until now

because some people on this forum cant handle someone with a different opinion and this usually ends in cheap insults. so i guess after seeing this for 4 years i was a little hesitant to come on and have my say.

TomHighwaysM16
14-8-11, 06:49
Isn't it allowed to criticize in this forum?

To the OP - I don't know if he will be good, nobody knows. I am sure that at the end of the year it will be all his fault, because he had the time, the money and fans on his side. Comolli has helped much in scouting and transfers.

At the end of the day, if we fail, it's all Kenny's fault. If we get back in CL, it's all his credit.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 06:50
Janno you might as well delete the thread mate because its pointless and not needed..

The OP is an idiot and has everyright to be called what i called him,

sorry genius, but thanks for clearing that up with some sort of educated response (thats sarcasm btw)

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 06:51
Glad I stayed off the football forum today... :confused:

and people call me clueless.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 06:53
Not going to neg nor shoot you down mate,but this is one game and ive said it before,Sunderland have also spent heavily and are quite a good side make no mistake,i believe Carrolls goal was legit and we hammered at them for 35/40 mins.We were very unfortunate not to be up 2/3 before the half,that said im also hurtin but im fully confident in Kenny and would certainly not want any other in charge.

You do not even need to see what he did 20yrs ago all you need do is look at the second half of last season,what he did for us,were his tactics against Chelsea not perfect?They were indeed.

thanks for a discussion, with no insults, I totally take what you said on board.

Ihaveadream
14-8-11, 06:54
sorry genius, but thanks for clearing that up with some sort of educated response (thats sarcasm btw)

Liverpoolsurfer welcome aboard.

You will hate it but keep coming back for more though like me.

Some fans you will just:FP: at because you will feel fellow reds are a joke.

Remember most are quite young on here now so you cannot always expect a great reply from them, young life is depressing so many come on here just on a break from the x-box, where they spend hours upon hours on Call of Duty.
But mention national service and then you realise they just like computer games.

:scarf

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 06:58
Walk out? how dare you even think about putting a statement like that to paper, after what he went through with Hillsborough and family problems .
I am speechless at such a crass comment. :mad:

so if gerrard or carra ever get the chance to manage this great club, should we protect them from any criticism no matter what, just because they have done so much for the club in the past. If so how dare anybody criticise rafa.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 07:02
As a newer fan myself, I don't know anyone before Rafa really. I've watched a lot of old clips, interviews and even read Kenny's book (which is pretty good)
and sometimes it seems like the tradition of the club is all people want to talk about, especially when things go bad, like they have in the recent past.
I, like many on here had some questions about the team selection today, even more so about a few missing players, but mostly about why we just hoofed it forward and forgot how to pass in the second half. It is probably not all Kenny's fault, and if we know anything from last season, its that he'll make them play right one way or another.
I think the pre-season was baffling to us all, and it didn't bode well when we saw so many mish-mash teams of players who never really played together come today.
That being said, from reading his book and hearing him talk about managing and the game itself, I think, in fact I know he is the right man for the job.
He has been able to get the best out of players most thought beyond help, and he will turn the overpriced Carroll into a gem, hopefully not by rolling him around in a barrel for a couple weeks, but by instilling a die hard work ethic into him, into all the players, giving them that same confidence whiskey nose does to the mancs, but without the bad breath.
I hope that answers your question, at least somewhat.
Welcome to the boards, I won't neg you unless you say something completely stupid btw, I've earned the negs I've gotten in the past for the most part. If you don't want to sit in the red, don't post stuff like this after even a draw. Although your comment about him walking out on the club does need some researching. I recommend you buy his book and you will find out why he left like he did.
Don't let those posters with 10,000+ posts fool you, they get ****y just like everyone else sometimes.
As for those who name call and drop negs on anything they don't like, quit being dicks. The poster has a right to his opinion and to be fair, was asking a question.
As for tradition, there is nothing wrong with tradition, without that I wouldn't even know who the hell LFC were. Neither would the millions of fans around the world. Tradition is what brought Suarez here and kept Gerrard.
Quit being nasty to one another. :(
YNWA

thanks mate.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 07:10
windup merchant. You sign up to these forums when you support another club. You're a joke....get a life .......

great response, no im not a wum, I love and support liverpool with all my heart but because I dont agree with you im a joke. sounds like you have some major issues. Is this a forum or a lets agree with everybody type thing, but good attemp at insulting someone (on the internet) and you tell me to get a life.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 07:12
Ill arrange a visit with her to see if you're telling the truth or not. Pass me on her number and a list of her most intimate details

NOW!! :mad::mad::mad:

I like your style, ill try and convince her.

BeautifulHistory
14-8-11, 07:23
Like I said in other topic you try to give the manager time specially Dalglish before you question him badly.

Don't think the tactics was wrong, more to do with the substitutions, commentators mentioned that Flanagan had picked up a knock what he was struggling in the second half because of it

I think he should have been taken off at half-time and replaced him with Kelly specially as we needed a bit more height in the defence as they were trying to bombard us with long balls.

And the strange decision of not having Maxi or Cole on the bench and preferring Spearing to them which is a bizarre thing to have, because you've got to have at least two players who could change the game with something different

having Meireles and either Maxi/Cole on the bench which is better ather than having Spearing & N'Gog

our sub bench got to be something like this when every one is fit,
Doni,Flanagan,Carragher,Meireles, Maxi,Kuyt, then either Aquilani/Henderson/Shelvey

AussieT
14-8-11, 07:26
Aquilani has that ability yet we play Adam who doesn't have that ability.

it applies to Lucas, Flano and most of all Carra. Carra is by far the worst.

SuperSpeedy
14-8-11, 07:28
it applies to Lucas, Flano and most of all Carra. Carra is by far the worst.

What?

Ihaveadream
14-8-11, 07:49
What?

Seconded

What?

Is he on about hoofing?

If he is then he just hates Lucas full stop.


Where do you watch the games Super?

Got abu dhabi sports so at home on the sofa for me, i thought we were excellent first half.

old-school
14-8-11, 07:57
your up early old school i didn't realise you had a sunday paper round as well.

:D

Alpha-kenny-wun
14-8-11, 08:25
Go Away.....

SuperSpeedy
14-8-11, 08:32
Seconded

What?

Is he on about hoofing?

If he is then he just hates Lucas full stop.


Where do you watch the games Super?

Got abu dhabi sports so at home on the sofa for me, i thought we were excellent first half.

Watched it at home to, do love Abu Dhabi sports. Every game for 5 quid a month. :scarf

stano123
14-8-11, 08:46
Kenny may have done things a little differently in that second half and I'm sure if he had a choice he would have spent less on a few of them players, but never the less it was the first game for gods sake.
I have some conserns, but thats all they are at the moment, because i know we have to give this team some time to gel, and give Kenny a little time and benefit that he knows what he is doing before you start judging him. Id give up on that research too.

Joe-El
14-8-11, 09:21
Relax hes a new poster just getting his point across and OP Kenny most defo is the King do not forget that please. (refer for future reference)

Call me cynical but I've read too many "This is my FIRST post" lines from people cowering away from red cards when they state negative views. How the hell are they so clued up on the politics of this forum? Maybe because its not just new members but rather old members with shiny new accounts.

First post my arsenal! The OP deserves all the negs he'll get for this insult of a thread... and I especially take offence at the WE in the title. Where did this WE come into it?

Digs9
14-8-11, 09:28
Mate stick to your guns you are only asking questions as a loyal fan.
However the answer to your question is HELL YES Kenny is the right man for the club but not solely because of history because of his knowledge of the game and because last season he proved he still had that knowledge by turning our season round, by beating MANURE and CHELSKI the2 top teams easy I might add, so regardless of his history if he hadnt saved our season and didnt prove this then history wouldnt matter because all fickle fans would have wanted his head. You are right in the fact he has paid to much for certain players but that is the market these days although I have to admit I think there where better options out there Yes maybe foreign but so wot at the minute British players are sorely lacking behind european quality. As for his tactics yesterday I think the one thing he has got wrong is playing Adam with Lucas, Lucas sits that is his Job but Adam and I dont know why decided he would sit and pass long balls all day, I am not a Lucas fan but he is our DM and we need someone attacking to play with him like Aqua, Meirleles and when he returns Gerrard. Playing 40 yard balls from ** own half when ** meant to be a box to box Midfielder is not the Liverpool way and I think Adam looks slow, Lazy and CANNOT tackle and just because he can deliver a dead ball does not make him a top class player, everyone now think if we qualify for europe next season how do you see Adam against a dynamic world class Midfielder when in my opinion he left big gaps yesterday against a rookie in Colback. So anyhow we have King Kenny,swap Adam for one of the mentioned and we have in my opinion a team more than capable of challenging for top 4 if not top 2.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 09:51
Have to agree with you about Adam. Time after time he let Sunderland's midfield run past him and then had to foul them to stop them. He needs to produce an awful lot more IMO. What really bothered me was that KD didn't seem to be able to change things when we were being overrun in midfield - same as in the last game last season against Spurs when we just let them dictate the game. All we needed to do was to not lose that game and we couldn't do it. I'm pessimistic about this season - I don't think that we have enough quality players to challenge for the top six never mind top four. And I can see both Reina and Saurez being off if that doesn't happen. We're in real danger of sliding into mid-table obscurity - and I've felt that since the end of last season not just because of one match of this.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:18
Call me cynical but I've read too many "This is my FIRST post" lines from people cowering away from red cards when they state negative views. How the hell are they so clued up on the politics of this forum? Maybe because its not just new members but rather old members with shiny new accounts.

First post my arsenal! The OP deserves all the negs he'll get for this insult of a thread... and I especially take offence at the WE in the title. Where did this WE come into it?

4 years of watching people like you allow me to be clued up. read my message.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:20
Mate stick to your guns you are only asking questions as a loyal fan.
However the answer to your question is HELL YES Kenny is the right man for the club but not solely because of history because of his knowledge of the game and because last season he proved he still had that knowledge by turning our season round, by beating MANURE and CHELSKI the2 top teams easy I might add, so regardless of his history if he hadnt saved our season and didnt prove this then history wouldnt matter because all fickle fans would have wanted his head. You are right in the fact he has paid to much for certain players but that is the market these days although I have to admit I think there where better options out there Yes maybe foreign but so wot at the minute British players are sorely lacking behind european quality. As for his tactics yesterday I think the one thing he has got wrong is playing Adam with Lucas, Lucas sits that is his Job but Adam and I dont know why decided he would sit and pass long balls all day, I am not a Lucas fan but he is our DM and we need someone attacking to play with him like Aqua, Meirleles and when he returns Gerrard. Playing 40 yard balls from ** own half when ** meant to be a box to box Midfielder is not the Liverpool way and I think Adam looks slow, Lazy and CANNOT tackle and just because he can deliver a dead ball does not make him a top class player, everyone now think if we qualify for europe next season how do you see Adam against a dynamic world class Midfielder when in my opinion he left big gaps yesterday against a rookie in Colback. So anyhow we have King Kenny,swap Adam for one of the mentioned and we have in my opinion a team more than capable of challenging for top 4 if not top 2.

thanks mate great post.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:26
Have to agree with you about Adam. Time after time he let Sunderland's midfield run past him and then had to foul them to stop them. He needs to produce an awful lot more IMO. What really bothered me was that KD didn't seem to be able to change things when we were being overrun in midfield - same as in the last game last season against Spurs when we just let them dictate the game. All we needed to do was to not lose that game and we couldn't do it. I'm pessimistic about this season - I don't think that we have enough quality players to challenge for the top six never mind top four. And I can see both Reina and Saurez being off if that doesn't happen. We're in real danger of sliding into mid-table obscurity - and I've felt that since the end of last season not just because of one match of this.

thanks, for a good honest reply, and actually looking at games without red tainted glasses. Everybody keeps going on about last year, but at the end of last year we faded worse than we did in thge second halfd yesterday. my worry is with 20 years out of the game can kenny change things when we desperately need it. something happend at half time we were good in the first half and crap in the second, what happend?

Scrams
14-8-11, 11:26
:FP: Wow. We played too deep yesterday but you really need to get in touch with the Liverpool way and gather knowledge of the king of anfield.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:29
Call me cynical but I've read too many "This is my FIRST post" lines from people cowering away from red cards when they state negative views. How the hell are they so clued up on the politics of this forum? Maybe because its not just new members but rather old members with shiny new accounts.

First post my arsenal! The OP deserves all the negs he'll get for this insult of a thread... and I especially take offence at the WE in the title. Where did this WE come into it?

and by the way, i didn't make the title of this thread it was the moderator. If this one offended you so much, im glad you didn't see the original title.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:32
:FP: Wow. We played too deep yesterday but you really need to get in touch with the Liverpool way and gather knowledge of the king of anfield.

if your so knowledgeable, give me some insight. I would appreicate it. (btw thats not sarcasm)

Scrams
14-8-11, 11:34
if your so knowledgeable, give me some insight. I would appreicate it. (btw thats not sarcasm)

Your a LFC fan right? and you need insight on King Kenny? :confused:

I would understand if my son had asked me, but come of it. I think your pulling my leg.

WirralRiddler
14-8-11, 11:50
TBH + IMO

I think Kenny made a few mistakes yesterday with the team selection.

1) Why was Flanno ahead of Kelly? Kelly should have played from the start at RB.

2) Kuyt should have been in the team.

3) Suarez should have been introduced from the bench in the second half.

4) Aqua, where was he? Should have been involved, off the bench too IMO.

5) Was Fabio injured? If so fair enough, if not then again it was a mistake to play Enrique from the start IMO.

My team would have been

Reina

Kelly carra agger Fabio(if fit??)

Henderson Lucas Adam

Kuyt Carroll Downing


with Aqua, Luis and Jose to come of the bench which IMO would have saved us from the dire second halve we ended up with.

Digs9
14-8-11, 11:53
Why are you all jumping on the lads back for questioning Kenny, as a fan we have probably all questioned managers but just because Kenny is King and a living LEGEND you think he is bigger the the Club. The lad admits he wasnt old enough to see Kenny play and manage so to him his Kenny is probably Fowler or Gerrard. Kenny is not the History be all and end all of our club yes he is a Legend but all you that are jumping on this lads back would probably be the first to call for Kennys head if we lost our first 3 games. That said Liverpool surfer you did make some comments about Kenny that were incorrect however im sure these historians of the club know everything from before there generation like all the supporters who slated the blue on our third kit when that blue is from our history also.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 11:57
Your a LFC fan right? and you need insight on King Kenny? :confused:

I would understand if my son had asked me, but come of it. I think your pulling my leg.

Im not pulling your leg. All im asking for is your opinion on why im not allowed to criticise kenny?

smokintony
14-8-11, 11:58
We're not expecting to win the league neither are we expected to, fourth is our target and if we get a better position along the way, fair enough, your whole first post is flawed.

I agree, Ive heard this said a lot the last few hours and yet a couple days ago many here were criticising anyone saying they didn't think we could win the league

Scrams
14-8-11, 11:59
Im not pulling your leg. All im asking for is your opinion on why im not allowed to criticise kenny?

You can criticise all you like mate.

Not knowing why he's rated so highly at LFC was the concerning factor.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:00
Why are you all jumping on the lads back for questioning Kenny, as a fan we have probably all questioned managers but just because Kenny is King and a living LEGEND you think he is bigger the the Club. The lad admits he wasnt old enough to see Kenny play and manage so to him his Kenny is probably Fowler or Gerrard. Kenny is not the History be all and end all of our club yes he is a Legend but all you that are jumping on this lads back would probably be the first to call for Kennys head if we lost our first 3 games. That said Liverpool surfer you did make some comments about Kenny that were incorrect however im sure these historians of the club know everything from before there generation like all the supporters who slated the blue on our third kit when that blue is from our history also.

what were the mistakes, I have in the last hour ordered kenny's book (well not me my girlfriend) but please give me an insight, I believe your talking about kenny walking out on the club? so in brief, why did he? thanks

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 12:01
To the people who are wondering what the original backlash was about - the original thread title was "Is Kenny Dalglish really any better than Roy Hodgson???"

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:09
You can criticise all you like mate.

Not knowing why he's rated so highly at LFC was the concerning factor.

I do know a bit about what kenny has done(not as much as some on here) but please he has not been a manager at the start of a season since 1990/91 I could understand you all giving it to me if it was ancelloti (spelling) or someone who has been winning titles recently, but unfortunately he's not.

red6
14-8-11, 12:09
Carroll's fee was dictated by factors which were out of our control. For example, we wanted whatever Carroll would cost + £15m for Torres. And that's coming from the big man John Henry's mouth. Stop focusing on the fee, at least we got a new number 9 and one with potential at that, Carroll could become a beast for us.

Henderson cost £16m btw, don't believe all you see on Sky Sports, and for his potential and the fact that he's English that's the average fee you'd expect, seeing as other players like Jones are going for similar prices. Just be glad that we're getting backed up and being allowed to buy the players we want, not like last year where we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for players like Konchesky and Poulsen.

Also, Kuyt and Meireles, two proven first team and international players were brought on, who did you want? Spearing and Doni? Just give the team some time to gel and the results will start rolling in.

I'm sure you love LFC, as we all do. But have some faith instead of sticking it to the players and management after 1 game, can you imagine if we all had your mindset?

Actually the game was crying out for Jay Spearings energy in midfield, Lucas was being overrun after Adam disappeared after 40 mins
Henderson is no better than Conor Coady, so why waste the money Carrol has come into the side and doesnt look to have the fitness or the intelligence to become anything more than a battering ram
The poster has a right to his opinion, Kenny has made mistakes in the close season & did so yesterday, hopefully he will sort things soon but that 4th place you crave looks a distance away
Oh by the way this is the 47th season i've been a red and the title should be our aim not a minor place

phuzz
14-8-11, 12:10
I do know a bit about what kenny has done(not as much as some on here) but please he has not been a manager at the start of a season since 1990/91 I could understand you all giving it to me if it was ancelloti (spelling) or someone who has been winning titles recently, but unfortunately he's not.

:rolleyes:

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 12:10
TBH + IMOI think Kenny made a few mistakes yesterday with the team selection.1) Why was Flanno ahead of Kelly? Kelly should have played from the start at RB.2) Kuyt should have been in the team.3) Suarez should have been introduced from the bench in the second half.4) Aqua, where was he? Should have been involved, off the bench too IMO.5) Was Fabio injured? If so fair enough, if not then again it was a mistake to play Enrique from the start IMO.My team would have beenReina
Kelly carra agger Fabio(if fit??)Henderson Lucas AdamKuyt Carroll Downingwith Aqua, Luis and Jose to come of the bench which IMO would have saved us from the dire second halve we ended up with.

I agree with you - the selection wasn't right. The first game is SO important and, IMO, KD should have started with the experience as far as he could and brought the new boys on. The problem of fading away needs to be addressed as a matter of urgency - against a better team we would have lost yesterday.

Scrams
14-8-11, 12:12
I do know a bit about what kenny has done(not as much as some on here) but please he has not been a manager at the start of a season since 1990/91 I could understand you all giving it to me if it was ancelloti (spelling) or someone who has been winning titles recently, but unfortunately he's not.

:confused: 90/91. He won the prem in 95

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:12
To the people who are wondering what the original backlash was about - the original thread title was "Is Kenny Dalglish really any better than Roy Hodgson???"

wow your back again, but still no educated response. I see all that green next to your name, and the best you come up with is to re-wright the original title. Clever

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:14
:confused: 90/91. He won the prem in 95

that shows how much I know, guess that was with blackburn and not liverpool. that can be my only excuse. My bad

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 12:15
Actually the game was crying out for Jay Spearings energy in midfield, Lucas was being overrun after Adam disappeared after 40 mins Henderson is no better than Conor Coady, so why waste the money Carrol has come into the side and doesnt look to have the fitness or the intelligence to become anything more than a battering ram
The poster has a right to his opinion, Kenny has made mistakes in the close season & did so yesterday, hopefully he will sort things soon but that 4th place you crave looks a distance away Oh by the way this is the 47th season i've been a red and the title should be our aim not a minor place

Spearing came to my mind as well - not because he's a better player but because his game is chasing and closing down - vital to deny the opposition time on the ball. We need to give Carroll time IMO; he's a good player with the ball at his feet and we need to use that and not keep lobbing high balls to him.

Digs9
14-8-11, 12:16
what were the mistakes, I have in the last hour ordered kenny's book (well not me my girlfriend) but please give me an insight, I believe your talking about kenny walking out on the club? so in brief, why did he? thanks

Mate he didnt walk out on the club but read the book Hillsborough really took it out of him but read his book.
You have a right to criticise as people did in the 80's no doubt people on here now giving you a lashing, people questioned when he signed Aldridge and Barnes, just like as a fan I am questioning Adam everyone can have an opinion and yes he is a legend but he is not the first and not the last. His tactics yesterday I do think he didnt have the mind to change the Midfield when Adam and Lucas were not effective and both faded out. But the reason I have faith is because when he came up against Fergie last season he showed he still has the knowledge of the game. Have faith mate No one was angrier and more upset than me after yesterday but I believe we will challenge this season once Carroll get better service and maybe we realise Adam isnt the answer Aqua then Gerrard when he is back. YNWA

Echos
14-8-11, 12:17
that shows how much I know, guess that was with blackburn and not liverpool. that can be my only excuse. My bad

your girlfriends bad

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:20
your girlfriends bad

yes she is, and so was michael jackson.

WirralRiddler
14-8-11, 12:21
To the people who are wondering what the original backlash was about - the original thread title was "Is Kenny Dalglish really any better than Roy Hodgson???"

:eek:

didnt know that TBF and the post I put earlier would have been completely different if I had have.

Kenny is so far away and above Roy it is not even measurable is it?

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:23
Mate he didnt walk out on the club but read the book Hillsborough really took it out of him but read his book.
You have a right to criticise as people did in the 80's no doubt people on here now giving you a lashing, people questioned when he signed Aldridge and Barnes, just like as a fan I am questioning Adam everyone can have an opinion and yes he is a legend but he is not the first and not the last. His tactics yesterday I do think he didnt have the mind to change the Midfield when Adam and Lucas were not effective and both faded out. But the reason I have faith is because when he came up against Fergie last season he showed he still has the knowledge of the game. Have faith mate No one was angrier and more upset than me after yesterday but I believe we will challenge this season once Carroll get better service and maybe we realise Adam isnt the answer Aqua then Gerrard when he is back. YNWA

thanks, im looking forward to reading his book. I will be checking the post with anticipation. As I said in my original post, I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves. I have not called for his head nor will i ever. Thats not up to me. I will stand by all involved in liverpool fc including poulsen and brad jones.

Digs9
14-8-11, 12:27
thanks, im looking forward to reading his book. I will be checking the post with anticipation. As I said in my original post, I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves. I have not called for his head nor will i ever. Thats not up to me. I will stand by all involved in liverpool fc including poulsen and brad jones.

And we all should be the same. Unfortunately my passion gets the best of me and although I want Lpool players to do well I am not overall impressed by Adam and whats more worrying is some people thought he was imense yesterday and on person compared him to Alonso so we all have opinions. Theres are just wrong LOL

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:31
To the people who are wondering what the original backlash was about - the original thread title was "Is Kenny Dalglish really any better than Roy Hodgson???"

I just dont get it. so much green and you hide from a good debate. is all that green just for your clever name or what? I agree i started my thread with a bad title. (thanks moderators for fixing that) but please give me your insight as to why you think kenny is above criticism?

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 12:38
I just dont get it. so much green and you hide from a good debate. is all that green just for your clever name or what? I agree i started my thread with a bad title. (thanks moderators for fixing that) but please give me your insight as to why you think kenny is above criticism?

He isn't, no-one is, but we should balance criticism with support for what he's trying to achieve - and criticism should be positive - we're all sooo good at telling him what he should be doing and who should be in the team, after all, we don't see the players every day in training.

Echos
14-8-11, 12:38
yes she is, and so was michael jackson.

are you comparing her to michael jackson?

Dashmundo
14-8-11, 12:40
I just dont get it. so much green and you hide from a good debate. is all that green just for your clever name or what? I agree i started my thread with a bad title. (thanks moderators for fixing that) but please give me your insight as to why you think kenny is above criticism?

I don't think anyone believes Kenny is above criticism. Most people don't agree with you belittling the work that has been done between January and now, and claiming Kenny lacks tactical knowledge based on our opening game.

Nobody's "hiding from a good debate". That's just absurd - this is an online forum.

Joe-El
14-8-11, 12:41
4 years of watching people like you allow me to be clued up. read my message.

People like me... mate maybe your time would have been better served watching some classic games with Dalglish in them so that you'd get clued up on the PAST (as you put it) and then analysed his league winning performances as a manager before you write such tripe.

There are many things that can be called into question from yesterdays game...

1. Where was Aquilani, Maxi and (dare I say it) Cole
2. What in the world was Henderson doing on the right apart from loitering
3. What (aside from his lucky 6 goals in 6 games feat) does Merieles bring to our side that led to him being brought on.

But questioning Dalglish as a manager, perhaps you need to have a word with yourself first. Oh and by the way... Welcome back ;)

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:43
I don't think anyone believes Kenny is above criticism. Most people don't agree with you belittling the work that has been done between January and now, and claiming Kenny lacks tactical knowledge based on our opening game.

Nobody's "hiding from a good debate". That's just absurd - this is an online forum.

so tell me why he comes on here with one liners and repeating the title but there is no actuall reponse. everybody is entitled to there opinion, all im asking for is his/anybodys.

WirralRiddler
14-8-11, 12:46
so tell me why he comes on here with one liners and repeating the title but there is no actuall reponse. everybody is entitled to there opinion, all im asking for is his/anybodys.

cus he is a douche.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 12:47
People like me... mate maybe your time would have been better served watching some classic games with Dalglish in them so that you'd get clued up on the PAST (as you put it) and then analysed his league winning performances as a manager before you write such tripe.

There are many things that can be called into question from yesterdays game...

1. Where was Aquilani, Maxi and (dare I say it) Cole
2. What in the world was Henderson doing on the right apart from loitering
3. What (aside from his lucky 6 goals in 6 games feat) does Merieles bring to our side that led to him being brought on.

But questioning Dalglish as a manager, perhaps you need to have a word with yourself first. Oh and by the way... Welcome back ;)

are you not questioning kenny now, and why do some off you think that im a past poster. to think I would need to change my name I dont get it. its the internet and I could'nt care what you think of me.

Shajan
14-8-11, 12:51
He's got a point though.
Saying 1 bad thing about Kenny and you will get -200000 rep and get harassed.

Kenny isn't perfect and neither was Rafa and Roy but he knowns what he is doing but that doesn't make everything OK. He knows the team did bad yesterday and he will try to fix it.

Tuta
14-8-11, 13:00
As someone who wasn't even born the last time we won the league, I can confirm that the thread title is the worst I have ever seen, .....

Are you on wind up again or you are really that young? :eek:

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:01
He's got a point though.
Saying 1 bad thing about Kenny and you will get -200000 rep and get harassed.

Kenny isn't perfect and neither was Rafa and Roy but he knowns what he is doing but that doesn't make everything OK. He knows the team did bad yesterday and he will try to fix it.

lets hope so. I do not claim to know everything (like some on here) and as I have shown, I will admit straight away when im wrong. why would I be concerned by getting rep or neg, what happens do i win something with more green or does someone come knock on my door and chin me if I get to much red. Or is this just like school again and green is cool red bad?

Joe-El
14-8-11, 13:05
are you not questioning kenny now, and why do some off you think that im a past poster. to think I would need to change my name I dont get it. its the internet and I could'nt care what you think of me.

King Kenny has my 100% backing, but I'm not a silly over optimist that posts blind faith crap followed by the now obligatory :scarf after such naff posts. Even if I (yes me) was manager of LFC (in my wildest fantasies :)) I'd still question things after a loss.

And its not a new thing for people to drop their previous LFC Forum identity (full of reds usually) and adopt a "Hello I'm new" stance. Some people have done it in the past and its obvious reading their posts who the are/were. Its not new here.

Me I had NINE red cards last September after posting that we should sack Hodgson (where are the numbskulls now eh) but now I'm down to one (at the moment... things change quickly) because I stick to my guns and posts what I truly believe even though some neg me regardless, I never considered ditching my profile... but many have, maybe you did too... either way, Welcome Back ;)

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:07
Na, na, na, na, na, na,
na, na, na, na, na
Baby give it up
Give it up
Baby give it up
Na, na, na, na, na, na,
na, na, na, na, na
Baby give it up
Give it up
Baby give it up

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:09
King Kenny has my 100% backing, but I'm not a silly over optimist that posts blind faith crap followed by the now obligatory :scarf after such naff posts. Even if I (yes me) was manager of LFC (in my wildest fantasies :)) I'd still question things after a loss.

And its not a new thing for people to drop their previous LFC Forum identity (full of reds usually) and adopt a "Hello I'm new" stance. Some people have done it in the past and its obvious reading their posts who the are/were. Its not new here.

Me I had NINE red cards last September after posting that we should sack Hodgson (where are the numbskulls now eh) but now I'm down to one (at the moment... things change quickly) because I stick to my guns and posts what I truly believe even though some neg me regardless, I never considered ditching my profile... but many have, maybe you did too... either way, Welcome Back ;)

why would you be worried about red cards, yes im new i just dont get it.

Pedagogue
14-8-11, 13:13
Kelly should have been at RB, Aqualini should have made at the least the bench if not the starting XI.

If we're to prise open the more obdurate of mid-table park-the-bus teams like them, we have to be more imaginative and penetrative throughout our game.

This is a lesson we should have learned by now.....

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 13:13
wow your back again, but still no educated response. I see all that green next to your name, and the best you come up with is to re-wright the original title. Clever

Write. Dumb.

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 13:14
Na, na, na, na, na, na,
na, na, na, na, na
Baby give it up
Give it up
Baby give it up
Na, na, na, na, na, na,
na, na, na, na, na
Baby give it up
Give it up
Baby give it up

:D

KoppityKloppity
14-8-11, 13:14
There was nothing wrong with the tactics in the first half we played decent football.
Things that worried me a bit were that even with the new signings we made the bench was still pretty poor only Kuyt could maybe change a game.
Don't know the reasons Aquilani or Maxi were not involved but one of them needed to be on the bench.

The other thing was when Raul came on why was he asked to play left mid/wing and Downing was playing through the middle?
I even saw Downing ask someone at least twice was he playing as a AMC before sticking to that position.
Surely when Raul came on he should of played in the middle Downing left and Kuyt right.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:16
why would you be worried about red cards, yes im new i just dont get it.

i get it now, i didn't realize if you move your coursor on the green it gives you a positive remark, but on my red it says "I can only hope to improve"
PLEASE HELP I NEED SOME GREEN! i cant live life thinking im in the red and can only hope to improve. Ill grab my sheep and you point me in the right direction.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:17
Write. Dumb.

are you serious, commenting on my spelling. F98k I hope your a teacher and not some lame person.

Joe-El
14-8-11, 13:20
why would you be worried about red cards, yes im new i just dont get it.

True reason, if you amass a lot of red cards people generally disregard your views as the meanderings of a "Wum" whatever that means. People don't take your views seriously and you won't be able to get involved properly in valid topics.

For instance, if the boards most popular member Fowi :) was to state a contentious point, people would contemplate his argument... however if one of those with a bunch of red cards said the same thing... Pandemonium!

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 13:21
i get it now, i didn't realize if you move your coursor on the green it gives you a positive remark, but on my red it says "I can only hope to improve"
PLEASE HELP I NEED SOME GREEN! i cant live life thinking im in the red and can only hope to improve. Ill grab my sheep and you point me in the right direction.

Apparently I'm an "unknown quantity":confused::confused:
I think that I'm quite proud of that:D Is it the same as a smoking gun? What should I be aimimg for?:D:scarf

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 13:21
are you serious, commenting on my spelling. F98k I hope your a teacher and not some lame person.

You are or you're.

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 13:24
Are you on wind up again or you are really that young? :eek:

I'm being serial.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:25
You are or you're.

wow you really are a women.

BewilderedLemon
14-8-11, 13:25
This forum = ******* idiots

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:26
I'm being serial.

your back with another 1 liner. are you arnold swartzinger.

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:26
True reason, if you amass a lot of red cards people generally disregard your views as the meanderings of a "Wum" whatever that means. People don't take your views seriously and you won't be able to get involved properly in valid topics.

For instance, if the boards most popular member Fowi :) was to state a contentious point, people would contemplate his argument... however if one of those with a bunch of red cards said the same thing... Pandemonium!

Ooooh you weaselly little arse licker.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:29
True reason, if you amass a lot of red cards people generally disregard your views as the meanderings of a "Wum" whatever that means. People don't take your views seriously and you won't be able to get involved properly in valid topics.

For instance, if the boards most popular member Fowi :) was to state a contentious point, people would contemplate his argument... however if one of those with a bunch of red cards said the same thing... Pandemonium!

so is it this like being cool at school. who cares what others on here think. im on here for good debate and to learn as much as i can about our great club and also to get some frustrations out.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:30
This forum = ******* idiots

and people on here say i'm a wum.

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 13:31
your back with another 1 liner. are you arnold swartzinger.

Is he related to Basten Schwinger?

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:32
and people on here say i'm a wum.

:D

You've been here about 5 minutes.... I'd say you're more of a bum.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:33
Is he related to Basten Schwinger?

your amazing, now I know who to follow to get the green. teach me master.

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 13:33
your amazing, now I know who to follow to get the green. teach me master.

Right, you need to love Ibra.

kam1
14-8-11, 13:33
Though I am a big fan of what Kenny has done and will do for the club; like everybody he is prone to mistakes.

He needs to experiment a bit to find the correct balance. He will get it right in my opinion.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:34
:D

You've been here about 5 minutes.... I'd say you're more of a bum.

and your green says your just really nice?

-Rianaldo-
14-8-11, 13:34
are you arnold swartzinger.

:D

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:34
Right, you need to love Ibra.

I beg to ******* differ...

He needs to love Lucas....

And hate Redknapp.... and Spurs...

He needs to burn White Hart Lane to the ******* ground.

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:35
and your green says your just really nice?

:D

This thread is a lesson in delusion.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:36
Right, you need to love Ibra.

Ibra it is, lead the way and me and my sheep will follow.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:37
I beg to ******* differ...

He needs to love Lucas....

And hate Redknapp.... and Spurs...

He needs to burn White Hart Lane to the ******* ground.

now im confussed, didn't thay try that last week?

WindyShepherdHenderson
14-8-11, 13:38
Ibra it is, lead the way and me and my sheep will follow.

http://forums.liverpoolfc.tv/showthread.php?t=215090

This is your church/synagogue/mosque/gurdwara/temple/non-denominational place of worship

Liddelwomen
14-8-11, 13:38
your amazing, now I know who to follow to get the green. teach me master.

All you need is love.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:40
All you need is love.

between my sheep and girlfriend im close but ill take anything i can get.

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 13:41
now im confussed, didn't thay try that last week?

They tried and they failed ******* useless cockneys.

This is why I've never been too confussed with people from the capital.

Shajan
14-8-11, 13:43
lets hope so. I do not claim to know everything (like some on here) and as I have shown, I will admit straight away when im wrong. why would I be concerned by getting rep or neg, what happens do i win something with more green or does someone come knock on my door and chin me if I get to much red. Or is this just like school again and green is cool red bad?

I always prefered red :D

-CADS-
14-8-11, 13:43
They tried and they failed ******* useless cockneys.

This is why I've never been too confussed with people from the capital.

At least their game was called off, that must be some sort of consolation right?

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 13:48
I always prefered red :D

red goes faster, the only green I like is money and the type you casn smoke.

albiedog
14-8-11, 13:54
Actually the game was crying out for Jay Spearings energy in midfield, Lucas was being overrun after Adam disappeared after 40 mins
Henderson is no better than Conor Coady, so why waste the money Carrol has come into the side and doesnt look to have the fitness or the intelligence to become anything more than a battering ram
The poster has a right to his opinion, Kenny has made mistakes in the close season & did so yesterday, hopefully he will sort things soon but that 4th place you crave looks a distance away
Oh by the way this is the 47th season i've been a red and the title should be our aim not a minor place

I've actually got a fair few more 'years' in as a home and away supporter than yourgoodself.

:)

I certainly go along with the gist of your post.

We certainly do have to trust Kenny to get it right. He is proven class as player and manager - amongst the finest ever in both genres - above all he is a dyed in the wool one of us, as are all his family which is easy to overlook, and ultimately will give everything for LFC. Any comparisons with the other imposter no matter how tenuous are an insult to everything that Liverpool Football Club represents. Hodgson was an imposter. Full stop. kenny is the real deal.

BUT

As the original poster was basically saying he isn't infallible [and incidentally Liverpool Surfer - he didn't walk out 20 years ago - he had a nervous breakdown brought on by a virtual post traumatic reaction to his incredible fortitude after Hillsborough]

Based on what I've seen so far, the selection of Henderson yesterday was simply unfathomable. The only possible reason I can see for it was he didn't want to embarrass the lad by him being the only outfield signing not selected. It backfired badly. If the lad had just been signed [for the £13 million plus £3million add-ons] then fair enough, I can see why he might have selected him to have a look at his new buy and give the fans a taster [the usual].

But the lad's been here a few months now. He was the first signing and whilst we have to believe that Kenny with his incredible footballing insight has seen something in him, God forbid the poor lad has heavily disguised whatever it is he's supposed to have in every one of the pre-season games so far.

So how on earth Kenny could think about selecting him ahead of tried and seasoned performers like Dirk Kuyt and Raul Miereles and even newbies who have at least some proven performances under their belts like Jay Spearing and Martin Kelly [I wouldn't mind seeing kelly filling in wide right at least he can run fast with the ball and put in a cross]. If the object of the exercise is to win the game and get points on the board then the Jordan henderson selection for this game is utterly bewildering.

Did he think Jordan was suddenly going to explode? What evidence did he have to justify such a notion because I can scarcely believe Henderson can have shown any attributes of significance on the training pitch that he hasn't shown in the pre-season games we've seen.

Now the Andy Carroll business.

I like Andy carroll and I think he can go on to be a real asset for us. He manifestly is not at the footballing level that you'd normally expect for a £35 million player but in the right formation with the right supply he gives the impression that he can be the battering ram Red6 alludes to.

BUT.

Since he came back into the side for those last two games of last season and Kenny ditched the Kuyt/Suarez spearhead [which had provided an incredible pressing platform for the rest of the team and a real fluidity up front that many teams found difficult to counter] the entire playing pattern of the team changed. Since then what we've had is the easy lobbed high outball to Carroll's head from the back which far too many of our defenders and midfielders have opted for rather than the pass and move build up play we saw - notably at Craven Cottage - when Kuyt and Suarez provided that superb outlet.

Frustratingly in tandem with the high often lazy and aimless ball to Carroll's head we've had no midfielders pressing high up the pitch in support to pounce on the knock downs. So often the end result is the ball harmlessly falling into the lap of the opposition defenders and midfielders.

THEN

There's the Aquilani business. This has to be the weirdest saga I've ever seen in all my years watching the club. Here we have this hugely gifted footballer who has excelled far and away above anyone else [bar Agger] in his limited pre-season cameos yet it appears he or the club [we don't which with any certainty] are hellbent on him going back to Italy.

My own opinion comes back to Kenny being backed into a corner. I think the decision to go full belt for Charlie Adam [who incidentally along with Downing and Enrique are real pluses for me] as his centre midfield kingpin was made before he found out Juventus were skint. Comfortably Aquilani's most effective position is in direct competition to Charlie as a kingpin. Aquilani's return complicated matters as Kenny is almost duty bound to have Charlie as kingpin if there is to be only one and by playing his 4-4-2 there isn't room for two kingpins as there would be with say a 4-1-2-3. So given the 4-4-2, Aquilani is no more than bit part in Kenny's plans and a quality saleable bit part on his high wages likely means a future elsewhere virtue of the owner's desire to reduce the wage bill.

Yet just imagine what this wonderful player might have contributed yesterday in the right role.

So there we are. Frustrations all round. Not what we hoped for. When the object of the exercise is to play good effective football and win a game - which it should always be - then you at least hope that your strongest team available is on the pitch attempting to playing the best football it can. Apart from a few cameos up the left side and a few individual sorties, that clearly wasn't the case yesterday. And it culminated pretty much into a shambles of a second half where we scarcely managed anything resembling an attack let alone an effort on goal.

On the positive side. It is only one game. It is probably too early to make judgements, although provided you rationalise them and put them in a time context and perspective, such judgements can remain positive in themselves.

Let's hope Kenny is putting on his objective head this week and rationalising things a bit better than he seemed to yesterday. Let's hope he sorts something out on the training ground that will work at the Emirates. Let's hope he's now seen that until he can find some more effective way of deploying the team to suit Andy Carroll that the best way is Kuyt and Suarez up front and Andy coming off the bench as Plan B. Also let's pray no Italian club come in for Aquilani and he gets his chance alongside Charlie Adam with Lucas sweeping behind them.

Who'd be a manager eh?

:)

-CADS-
14-8-11, 13:56
^^^^^^^^^

I christen you "the new Snipes".

ScouseSoxNation
14-8-11, 13:56
You sir, are a clown!

Gazza74
14-8-11, 13:58
Ok, first thing i'll say is ALL managers make mistakes, get it wrong, possibly cost matches for their team, the greats do it to, Ferguson, hate him, but he is a great, does it, get his teams wrong and costs his side results, but he doesn't do it enough to cost them titles over 38 games.

Kenny IS a GREAT manager to, that isn't up for debate and he made mistakes, got things wrong, cost us points and baffled plenty the first time he was here.

By Christmas in 1985, his first spell as manager, many questioned if the club had got it wrong in appointing him player-manager and whether it was just to soon. We'd struggled a fair bit, he'd struggled and it wasn't looking like the Liverpool we'd been for 20 years.

But he rallied the troops, said that we needed to improve our away form, and after Christmas we went on a great run and ended up clinching the title on the last weekend, then went on to win the double. The rest for Kenny is history and had the terrible event of 1989 not happened he'd have won a lot more than his 3 league titles and many other trophies to IMO.

He made plenty of mistakes back then, baffled people with signings and team selections, had many scratching their heads after a draw or defeat, but like Ferguson, Kenny has genius and over a 42 or 38 games season he can get a hell of a lot more things right that mean we can be celebrating titles and trophies come May.

We've played one game, just one, and if we'd had a bit more luck in that excellent first half display we'd have been 3-0 up and would all be happy today instead of frustrated. Why we fell away in that 2nd half, who knows, but to make a judgement on his signings, on Kenny himself, on everything, based on just one game we didn't win is pretty stupid really.

One game gone, Kenny possibly made mistakes, but then again we should have been out of sight by half time and in that respect and the first half display Kenny got the team selection right in the main and it wasn't his fault we ended that half at only 1-0. The 2nd half he can be blamed for not changing it right or having the options on the bench, but again, had we been 3-0 up, as we should have been, it wouldn't have been needed.

I'm not sure what the OP is actually saying, is he saying he wants Kenny replaced?....It seems to infer that in the first post as he doesn't think Kenny is up to the job and has decided this after the summer signings and one league game we drew.

If he doesn't mean this i'd like to know what the tone of this thread is as he isn't just questioning Kenny for yesterday he seems to be questioning Kenny as manager. If so, what's his solution?..New manager?..If so who. Again, i'm not saying this is what the OP is saying, just the impression from some of the comments, they seem to intimate Kenny is the wrong man for the job and will always be.

My only response is what i've said above, it's one game and Kenny deserves more than one game in his first full season to prove himself 2nd time round. If you look right back to 1985 and the managers since Kenny, no manager has had an amazing first season without struggles.

I mentioned 85/86 above, which ended well, but didn't start great for Kenny. Souness was mediocre in 1991/92 in the league, Roy Evans did decent, but not spectacular during his first full season in 1994/95, Houllier finished 7th in his first full season that began with joint managership until early October, 4th when he was on his own in 99/00. Rafa didn't have a great first season in the league in 04/05 and failed to get in the top 4. Roy was just poor and got sacked in January.

All of them had struggles in their first full seasons and for differing reasons, but aside from Hodgson they all came through that first season and went on to be a lot better, in Kenny's case he was world class after his initial 5/6 months of struggle in 85/86.

My point is, all made mistakes, all made odd signings, all got poor results in their first season, but, all were allowed that first season bedding in and getting their football ideas across and especially if they've made a lot of changes to the team and squad which will always take time and have teething problems.

Kenny is a world class manager and we need to judge him over more than just one league game, a game that, yes, hasn't gone well, but is still only one game. Same with the new signings. They all looked good for 45 minutes yesterday and showed promise for when they gel further and intergrate further, so despite that 2nd half mystery we can be excited for me.

But again, with Kenny and with them, it's his and their first full season here and they need more than 1 game before being written off. Question Kenny, sure, for the one game yesterday, but bigger picture wise let's see how it pans out over the season before asking whether he's as good as the first time round and can take us back where he last had us.

He will make mistakes, he did make mistakes last time, all manager do, it isn't unique to Kenny. But what is unique to him, like with other great managers, is he can still win titles inspite of these mistakes and i believe this is still the case with him in the present day because you dont lose that genius and magic.

The OP may not have meant to but some of his comments suggest he may want Kenny replaced as he doesn't think he'll ever be the right manager and that is just silly after just one game in the league and a draw in it. Maybe wait to see what happens over the season and at least give Kenny a good batch of matches and see where we are then before making claims like this.

Kenny isn't perfect, he wasn't the first time round, but he is a winner and like all great manager and winners, he can overcome his inperfections and mistakes and win titles and trophies and i'll be shocked if he still can't do that now as he's older, more experienced and for me better than he was back in the 80s, so let's relax and give the man a chance to rebuild fully and get over the teething problems and mistakes that always come in a managers first full season.

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 14:01
Good stuff Gazza, although I'll read that again before bedtime tonight ;)

Vayanovic
14-8-11, 14:03
The least you could is to wait until at least Christmas and then review Kenny's tactics and whether the signings are actually worth the price paid for. What's the point of doing it after one game, it makes you look silly and ******* impatient.

I too, after watching Hendo yesterday have some doubts but it was his debut and it seemed he was more conservative and regardless of how he played we'll only find out if he's worth 20M when we see a lot more of him and he starts to play his natural game.

As for Carroll, he's an immense physical presence and i think he showed that especially in the 1st half yesterday, and i'm sure as the season goes along we'll realize that if we hadn't made that 35M pound bid, someone else would have eventually done it.

I thought the performance in the 1st half yesterday was exceptional, and somehow for some reason we faded away in the second, i don't know why, whether it was due to fatigue or frustration due to the fact that perhaps we should have take our chances ( the penalty etc.)

All in all i believe if we look at the positives from yesterday this team does have a massive potential so don't lose hope. Also,the premier league is getting tougher and tougher, even a team like Sunderland cannot be considered as a small team anymore, the league is going to be tight again hence i believe that even if we didn't get 3 points on the starting day, 1 point isn't that bad as we saw that even Arsenal had an extremely tough day.

Cheers and here's to a better season than last year :scarf

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 14:03
I've actually got a fair few more 'years' in as a home and away supporter than yourgoodself.

:)

I certainly go along with the gist of your post.

We certainly do have to trust Kenny to get it right. He is proven class as player and manager - amongst the finest ever in both genres - above all he is a dyed in the wool one of us, as are all his family which is easy to overlook, and ultimately will give everything for LFC. Any comparisons with the other imposter no matter how tenuous are an insult to everything that Liverpool Football Club represents. Hodgson was an imposter. Full stop. kenny is the real deal.

BUT

As the original poster was basically saying he isn't infallible [and incidentally Liverpool Surfer - he didn't walk out 20 years ago - he had a nervous breakdown brought on by a virtual post traumatic reaction to his incredible fortitude after Hillsborough]

Based on what I've seen so far, the selection of Henderson yesterday was simply unfathomable. The only possible reason I can see for it was he didn't want to embarrass the lad by him being the only outfield signing not selected. It backfired badly. If the lad had just been signed [for the £13 million plus £3million add-ons] then fair enough, I can see why he might have selected him to have a look at his new buy and give the fans a taster [the usual].

But the lad's been here a few months now. He was the first signing and whilst we have to believe that Kenny with his incredible footballing insight has seen something in him, God forbid the poor lad has heavily disguised whatever it is he's supposed to have in every one of the pre-season games so far.

So how on earth Kenny could think about selecting him ahead of tried and seasoned performers like Dirk Kuyt and Raul Miereles and even newbies who have at least some proven performances under their belts like Jay Spearing and Martin Kelly [I wouldn't mind seeing kelly filling in wide right at least he can run fast with the ball and put in a cross]. If the object of the exercise is to win the game and get points on the board then the Jordan henderson selection for this game is utterly bewildering.

Did he think Jordan was suddenly going to explode? What evidence did he have to justify such a notion because I can scarcely believe Henderson can have shown any attributes of significance on the training pitch that he hasn't shown in the pre-season games we've seen.

Now the Andy Carroll business.

I like Andy carroll and I think he can go on to be a real asset for us. He manifestly is not at the footballing level that you'd normally expect for a £35 million player but in the right formation with the right supply he gives the impression that he can be the battering ram Red6 alludes to.

BUT.

Since he came back into the side for those last two games of last season and Kenny ditched the Kuyt/Suarez spearhead [which had provided an incredible pressing platform for the rest of the team and a real fluidity up front that many teams found difficult to counter] the entire playing pattern of the team changed. Since then what we've had is the easy lobbed high outball to Carroll's head from the back which far too many of our defenders and midfielders have opted for rather than the pass and move build up play we saw - notably at Craven Cottage - when Kuyt and Suarez provided that superb outlet.

Frustratingly in tandem with the high often lazy and aimless ball to Carroll's head we've had no midfielders pressing high up the pitch in support to pounce on the knock downs. So often the end result is the ball harmlessly falling into the lap of the opposition defenders and midfielders.

THEN

There's the Aquilani business. This has to be the weirdest saga I've ever seen in all my years watching the club. Here we have this hugely gifted footballer who has excelled far and away above anyone else [bar Agger] in his limited pre-season cameos yet it appears he or the club [we don't which with any certainty] are hellbent on him going back to Italy.

My own opinion comes back to Kenny being backed into a corner. I think the decision to go full belt for Charlie Adam [who incidentally along with Downing and Enrique are real pluses for me] as his centre midfield kingpin was made before he found out Juventus were skint. Comfortably Aquilani's most effective position is in direct competition to Charlie as a kingpin. Aquilani's return complicated matters as Kenny is almost duty bound to have Charlie as kingpin if there is to be only one and by playing his 4-4-2 there isn't room for two kingpins as there would be with say a 4-1-2-3. So given the 4-4-2, Aquilani is no more than bit part in Kenny's plans and a quality saleable bit part on his high wages likely means a future elsewhere virtue of the owner's desire to reduce the wage bill.

Yet just imagine what this wonderful player might have contributed yesterday in the right role.

So there we are. Frustrations all round. Not what we hoped for. When the object of the exercise is to play good effective football and win a game - which it should always be - then you at least hope that your strongest team available is on the pitch attempting to playing the best football it can. Apart from a few cameos up the left side and a few individual sorties, that clearly wasn't the case yesterday. And it culminated pretty much into a shambles of a second half where we scarcely managed anything resembling an attack let alone an effort on goal.

On the positive side. It is only one game. It is probably too early to make judgements, although provided you rationalise them and put them in a time context and perspective, such judgements can remain positive in themselves.

Let's hope Kenny is putting on his objective head this week and rationalising things a bit better than he seemed to yesterday. Let's hope he sorts something out on the training ground that will work at the Emirates. Let's hope he's now seen that until he can find some more effective way of deploying the team to suit Andy Carroll that the best way is Kuyt and Suarez up front and Andy coming off the bench as Plan B. Also let's pray no Italian club come in for Aquilani and he gets his chance alongside Charlie Adam with Lucas sweeping behind them.

Who'd be a manager eh?

:)

great post, f65k fowi must be good.

albiedog
14-8-11, 14:07
You sir, are a clown!

Ha ha said the clown.

:)

coachwatson
14-8-11, 14:12
it applies to Lucas, Flano and most of all Carra. Carra is by far the worst.

Actually Lucas has the ability to pass and move his way through defenses.

liverpoolsurfer
14-8-11, 14:22
Ok, first thing i'll say is ALL managers make mistakes, get it wrong, possibly cost matches for their team, the greats do it to, Ferguson, hate him, but he is a great, does it, get his teams wrong and costs his side results, but he doesn't do it enough to cost them titles over 38 games.

Kenny IS a GREAT manager to, that isn't up for debate and he made mistakes, got things wrong, cost us points and baffled plenty the first time he was here.

By Christmas in 1985, his first spell as manager, many questioned if the club had got it wrong in appointing him player-manager and whether it was just to soon. We'd struggled a fair bit, he'd struggled and it wasn't looking like the Liverpool we'd been for 20 years.

But he rallied the troops, said that we needed to improve our away form, and after Christmas we went on a great run and ended up clinching the title on the last weekend, then went on to win the double. The rest for Kenny is history and had the terrible event of 1989 not happened he'd have won a lot more than his 3 league titles and many other trophies to IMO.

He made plenty of mistakes back then, baffled people with signings and team selections, had many scratching their heads after a draw or defeat, but like Ferguson, Kenny has genius and over a 42 or 38 games season he can get a hell of a lot more things right that mean we can be celebrating titles and trophies come May.

We've played one game, just one, and if we'd had a bit more luck in that excellent first half display we'd have been 3-0 up and would all be happy today instead of frustrated. Why we fell away in that 2nd half, who knows, but to make a judgement on his signings, on Kenny himself, on everything, based on just one game we didn't win is pretty stupid really.

One game gone, Kenny possibly made mistakes, but then again we should have been out of sight by half time and in that respect and the first half display Kenny got the team selection right in the main and it wasn't his fault we ended that half at only 1-0. The 2nd half he can be blamed for not changing it right or having the options on the bench, but again, had we been 3-0 up, as we should have been, it wouldn't have been needed.

I'm not sure what the OP is actually saying, is he saying he wants Kenny replaced?....It seems to infer that in the first post as he doesn't think Kenny is up to the job and has decided this after the summer signings and one league game we drew.

If he doesn't mean this i'd like to know what the tone of this thread is as he isn't just questioning Kenny for yesterday he seems to be questioning Kenny as manager. If so, what's his solution?..New manager?..If so who. Again, i'm not saying this is what the OP is saying, just the impression from some of the comments, they seem to intimate Kenny is the wrong man for the job and will always be.

My only response is what i've said above, it's one game and Kenny deserves more than one game in his first full season to prove himself 2nd time round. If you look right back to 1985 and the managers since Kenny, no manager has had an amazing first season without struggles.

I mentioned 85/86 above, which ended well, but didn't start great for Kenny. Souness was mediocre in 1991/92 in the league, Roy Evans did decent, but not spectacular during his first full season in 1994/95, Houllier finished 7th in his first full season that began with joint managership until early October, 4th when he was on his own in 99/00. Rafa didn't have a great first season in the league in 04/05 and failed to get in the top 4. Roy was just poor and got sacked in January.

All of them had struggles in their first full seasons and for differing reasons, but aside from Hodgson they all came through that first season and went on to be a lot better, in Kenny's case he was world class after his initial 5/6 months of struggle in 85/86.

My point is, all made mistakes, all made odd signings, all got poor results in their first season, but, all were allowed that first season bedding in and getting their football ideas across and especially if they've made a lot of changes to the team and squad which will always take time and have teething problems.

Kenny is a world class manager and we need to judge him over more than just one league game, a game that, yes, hasn't gone well, but is still only one game. Same with the new signings. They all looked good for 45 minutes yesterday and showed promise for when they gel further and intergrate further, so despite that 2nd half mystery we can be excited for me.

But again, with Kenny and with them, it's his and their first full season here and they need more than 1 game before being written off. Question Kenny, sure, for the one game yesterday, but bigger picture wise let's see how it pans out over the season before asking whether he's as good as the first time round and can take us back where he last had us.

He will make mistakes, he did make mistakes last time, all manager do, it isn't unique to Kenny. But what is unique to him, like with other great managers, is he can still win titles inspite of these mistakes and i believe this is still the case with him in the present day because you dont lose that genius and magic.

The OP may not have meant to but some of his comments suggest he may want Kenny replaced as he doesn't think he'll ever be the right manager and that is just silly after just one game in the league and a draw in it. Maybe wait to see what happens over the season and at least give Kenny a good batch of matches and see where we are then before making claims like this.

Kenny isn't perfect, he wasn't the first time round, but he is a winner and like all great manager and winners, he can overcome his inperfections and mistakes and win titles and trophies and i'll be shocked if he still can't do that now as he's older, more experienced and for me better than he was back in the 80s, so let's relax and give the man a chance to rebuild fully and get over the teething problems and mistakes that always come in a managers first full season.

great post, i dont want kenny sacked. but his substitutions in the second half and the fact of no maxi or aqua on the bench makes me very worried about how long kenny has been out of the game. you make some great points in your post. Thanks

naturalskill
14-8-11, 15:17
great post, i dont want kenny sacked. but his substitutions in the second half and the fact of no maxi or aqua on the bench makes me very worried about how long kenny has been out of the game. you make some great points in your post. Thanks

Kenny has just done half a season before the break and in the League came second only to Fergie for that period. He achieved that having to dig very deep into a squad most had written off. He managed wins over Utd and Chelsea among others if you remember. There were a few mistakes but then nobody is perfect. Kenny is now building a new team. A little patience would be more appropriate than crying and wailing over a virtual stranger we have struggled to get rid of. The Aquilani fan club really need to accept that he just might not be part of Kenny's blueprint especially with a fit Suarez and Gerrard in the picture. All those baffled by the inclusion of Henderson need to understand that the kid is definately part of Kenny's blueprint and there are no doubt various reasons why - such as his versatility, the amount of ground he covers and yes his creativity which admittedly we have not seen too much of YET but which the facts suggest he does have. He is still learning and he atleast played a part in closing down Mata in that friendly recently. Anyway, the main reason we will see more of him under Kenny is the versatility he brings being able to play right accross the midfield which will contribute hugely to this "fluidity" everybody wants to see. But the lad and Kenny must be given time before the knives come out. I see this thread has actually provoked some interesting responses...one in particular which you seemed to like suggested Kenny re-assess and then hopefully go with a 4123 accommodating Aquilani. Personally, I'd love to see us play some 4123 but since Kenny brought in Suarez and Carroll we have predominantly focussed on 442 when both available and 4231 in the absence of one or the other. Who knows what we might evolve into but at this embryonic stage far more patience is called for.

redgav9
14-8-11, 15:26
I would like to start by welcoming myself to the forum, (because after my first post, I dont think many of you will be to welcoming) thats ok I like the colour red alot more than green anyway.

I have been reading these forums almost everyday for the last 4 years (I know get a life) and seen everybody cop it from SG to lucas. In the eyes of most on these forums, Rafa was never good enough for liverpool not to mention Roy Hodgson.

My qusetion is, is Kenny good enough to manage liverpool fc? I unfortunately was too young to remember the great things he did for this club, in the PAST!
as a player and a manager but from what I have read and seen, on these forums, he is the king of liverpool fc. Yet after the players he has brought to the club and yesterdays game I think I have the right to question him.

Yes I know its the first game and I should wait and see. I will give kenny the respect any liverpool manager deserves, but im tired of seeing so many posters caught up in who kenny used to be rather than who he is now.

Lets face FACTS. kenny has spent alot of money and if roy or rafa had brought some of the players he has brought they would be burnt at the stake.

35 million on carrol - more like a 15 million player
20 million on hendo - more like a 8 million player

To me just on these 2 players alone we wasted 32 million enough to by a couple of decent players shawcross/cahill and a new striker.

his tactics in yesterdays game were poor as well. Why start with all our new players on the park. Hendo should never have started, he was average at best. It was a great first half, but in the second we were so flat and the game was crying out for a skillfull attacking player, like aqua. what subs does he make, kuyt for hendo then raul for suarez, it was 1-1 not 3-0. raul was non existant. aqua has been one of the better player in pre season and kenny has said he is staying, so why not use him?

sorry for being so negative in my first post. i had anticipated the start of the season more than any other in the last 20 years but i feel like we will all be let down again.
Lets hope im wrong, but if things do go wrong I wonder if kenny will walk out on this great club again?


first game of the season! For 60 mins we were great, it takes time for players to gel. You also forgot to look at the truth, Suarez fluffed a Peno, they should have had 10 men and we scored a perfectly good second goal. Another day we would have got the rub of the green and game would be over. Yes we tired Arsenal drew and Chelsea just have. 6 from the first 9 would have been good if we beat arsenal it won’t make a difference.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 15:33
Kenny has just done half a season before the break and in the League came second only to Fergie for that period. He achieved that having to dig very deep into a squad most had written off. He managed wins over Utd and Chelsea among others if you remember. There were a few mistakes but then nobody is perfect. Kenny is now building a new team. A little patience would be more appropriate than crying and wailing over a virtual stranger we have struggled to get rid of. The Aquilani fan club really need to accept that he just might not be part of Kenny's blueprint especially with a fit Suarez and Gerrard in the picture. All those baffled by the inclusion of Henderson need to understand that the kid is definately part of Kenny's blueprint and there are no doubt various reasons why - such as his versatility, the amount of ground he covers and yes his creativity which admittedly we have not seen too much of YET but which the facts suggest he does have. He is still learning and he atleast played a part in closing down Mata in that friendly recently. Anyway, the main reason we will see more of him under Kenny is the versatility he brings being able to play right accross the midfield which will contribute hugely to this "fluidity" everybody wants to see. But the lad and Kenny must be given time before the knives come out. I see this thread has actually provoked some interesting responses...one in particular which you seemed to like suggested Kenny re-assess and then hopefully go with a 4123 accommodating Aquilani. Personally, I'd love to see us play some 4123 but since Kenny brought in Suarez and Carroll we have predominantly focussed on 442 when both available and 4231 in the absence of one or the other. Who knows what we might evolve into but at this embryonic stage far more patience is called for.

Great points - but surely the way to help new players to bed in and develop within our style of play is to put them on the subs bench and keep giving them 25mins alongside the old hands and not to load them with too much responsibility from the start. Just watched Ryan Shawcross play Torres out of the game - we need him - he's streets ahead of Martin Skrtel.

MiroTheRed
14-8-11, 15:56
sorry genius, but thanks for clearing that up with some sort of educated response (thats sarcasm btw)


Thanks mate i figured that you ******

shody1976
14-8-11, 16:01
Jeez, yet another clueless thread criticising the team and manager after one game. It's just getting boring now. Why not at least give Kenny 4-5 games before jumping to these sort of conclusions? He has won the title 4 times as a manager, so I think we can all be pretty confident that he knows what he's doing.

lauriantero
14-8-11, 16:11
I have to say I disagree with the op in many things. I think we have spent wisely in general. We've payed over the odds on some players, but also under the odds on others. But the point is, I think every single player we've brought in have been good ones, and they have improved our team. I'm glad we are willing to pay big money on players we want.

We can always say we should have bought this or that player, but it's not that easy. You don't just buy players like in fantasy football.

On tactics and team selection, I don't think they were wrong at all yesterday. Yes, we took a risk in playing Enrique, but he did well. We took a risk in playing Suarez, but he scored the goal. We had many new faces, but you have to introduce them at some point anyway. Downing and Adam are probably our best players in their respective positions and we were right to play them. Henderson was good in pre-season and it was against his old team, so I can understand playing him as well.

I think the tactics was good as well. We played to our strengths, and in the first half we were very good. The second half wasn't that good, and I don't know why. Maybe we should have had Aquilani or Maxi in the bench to give us mor attacking options, but who knows. These things just happen. Arsenal or Chelsea have not had good starts to the season either. The first game is always difficult.

Old merits shouldn't count, but Kenny showed last season he's still got it. That's why it's silly imo to question his abilities based on one game. I just hate these knee jerk reactions. Lets just wait and see how things go. I'm still very confident.

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 16:22
To the people who are wondering what the original backlash was about - the original thread title was "Is Kenny Dalglish really any better than Roy Hodgson???"

Now I understand why people lost their minds. I wouldn't have negged him for it, but I wouldn't have read a post like that.
Don't worry he'll come around when he finds out more, then he'll go "oh that's why they got **********"
I said some stupid things at first too and spent some time in the red before finding my feet.
What I don't like is how nasty some people get about it.

Tridentuk
14-8-11, 16:22
kenny dalgish has a record as manager of liverpool and blackburn that for the things he did at both clubs his record arguably surpasses that of ferguson..

plus when he was building arguably the best liverpool team of all time a few of his key transfers were criticised by fans with perspectives very much like yourself..

does that answer your question?

Navredman
14-8-11, 16:28
Next time skip the doctor, go to the vet instead tell him you need horse tablets, the one's the doc gave you are not working :rolleyes:

grenny158
14-8-11, 16:30
how can you call me clueless? I watched the game like everyone else and im very disapointed. Tell me is carroll a 35 million player what about hendo 20 million? and please you cant honestly believe we should have started with all 4 new players in a must win game. do you honestly believe kenny made the right substitutions? dont just call someone clueless without giving some reasons why. I love this club as much as anyone ( just ask my girlfriend) but as kenny says "no one person is bigger than LFC

Then try be a little more even handed with your posting. Is Suarez a 22m player? No, he is probably worth at least 30m .. is Enrique a 6m player? No, more like 10m. Is Adam a 8m player? More like 12-14 in this market.

You clearly are one of those supporters who looks at everything from a depressed point of view - which is cool if that's your way, but don't get upset when people take you to task and think you're a bit of a moron.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 16:34
Jeez, yet another clueless thread criticising the team and manager after one game. It's just getting boring now. Why not at least give Kenny 4-5 games before jumping to these sort of conclusions? He has won the title 4 times as a manager, so I think we can all be pretty confident that he knows what he's doing.

You're right but the problem is that, with 3pts for a win and 1 for a draw, the gap after only 4/5 games can be huge and it's vital that we get a good start - the last time we were seriously title contenders we got off to a flyer.

Tridentuk
14-8-11, 16:35
carroll for newcastle was a 35M player no doubt- the issue is whether it was a one-off or actual class. carroll had a fantastic goals-to-minutes ratio at newcastle, as well as a handful of assists and, i'm sure you'll agree, all round magnificent play.
if he's as good a player as he showed at newcastle he's worth every penny alan shearer would have been worth because he'll score almost as many goals, get many more assists and be even more imposing.

but like i said, it's the GAMBLE not the QUALITY that is of concern.

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 16:36
yes she is, and so was michael jackson.

So you're a Fulham fan!! :D

Plan-D
14-8-11, 16:37
I was at the game yesterday, as I usually am, I have a pretty good view on the game and I am a bit of an analyst. The problem wasn't anything tactical yesterday in my view, first half we were brilliant, second, not so good, we simply just lost our way in the second half and we couldn't sustain the quality we showed in the first half, it's as simple as that mate. Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong, the players just didn't keep the quality up, that's football.

aRandomNameHere
14-8-11, 16:41
I did watch the end of last season, it was great. that kind off thing happens when a new manager comes in. look atwhat roy did at west brom. shorely that was a bigger achievement.

:D

To respond to your initial point, try not basing your opinion of a footballer on 1 game of football. Every great in the premier league has started off slowly with exception to Van Nistelrooy and Torres (who is now struggling). This team has had no time to gel yet and you could tell it was fatigue that was the issue, the game got crazy sloppy.

I hear what you're saying but your points are ill timed and poorly justified. You have to give players a full season to show what they can do.

Gazza74
14-8-11, 16:44
I was at the game yesterday, as I usually am, I have a pretty good view on the game and I am a bit of an analyst. The problem wasn't anything tactical yesterday in my view, first half we were brilliant, second, not so good, we simply just lost our way in the second half and we couldn't sustain the quality we showed in the first half, it's as simple as that mate. Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong, the players just didn't keep the quality up, that's football.

Fair assessment and similar to the one i got from the couple of lads i spoke to last night who went the game and one i would give after watching the match myself and did earlier in the thread.

I think once the fitness improves for all the players and they're not at different levels, plus the new players gel further and get integrated more we'll see 90 minute performances rather than 45-60 minutes.

It would have been more alarming to me if we'd played an XI similar to last season and had only one new face in it, but as we have new players, new manager trying to change everything, there's bound to be teething problems this season and it won't all go swimmingly.

It should improve as the season goes on though i'm sure and lot's will be gained and learnt from yesterday i'm sure.

MickeyLove
14-8-11, 16:46
I'm sure it's been pointed out already, but I'm getting a bit sick of seeing it said that Henderson cost 20 million when in fact he was a fair bit less than that.

Gazza74
14-8-11, 17:07
I'm sure it's been pointed out already, but I'm getting a bit sick of seeing it said that Henderson cost 20 million when in fact he was a fair bit less than that.

I know, it annoys the hell out of me aswell.

The fee could be anything from £13m to £20m as £13m, £16m, £18m, £19m and £20m have all been bandied about in the media and were before we bought him, to which Comolli said none were the actual fee.

The common one seems to be £16m but that could be more that it's in the middle of the £13m and £20m guesses and so it's just been run with, what the actual fee is is anyone's guess and could be lower than even £16m.

shody1976
14-8-11, 17:08
I'm sure it's been pointed out already, but I'm getting a bit sick of seeing it said that Henderson cost 20 million when in fact he was a fair bit less than that.

To be honest, I'm sick of seeing negative threads questioning the manager after only 1 game.

FIOS
14-8-11, 17:09
I was at the game yesterday, as I usually am, I have a pretty good view on the game and I am a bit of an analyst. The problem wasn't anything tactical yesterday in my view, first half we were brilliant, second, not so good, we simply just lost our way in the second half and we couldn't sustain the quality we showed in the first half, it's as simple as that mate. Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong, the players just didn't keep the quality up, that's football.

That's pretty much how I saw it. It's disapointing that we still see games like this because it's been something of a trait of ours for a while. Dominate the opening periods and go in front but then pay the price for not killing the game off by taking the chances we create. We were unfortunate to go in at half time only 1-0 up because with a little more luck we could (and should) have been 3 up. Had we got the second goal we deserved but still dropped off as we did in the second half, I think most would be saying Kenny got it right.

We just never really turned up in the second half, and failing to capitalise when we were on top is what ultimately cost us. Annoyingly we didn't respond once they equalised but again that is something of a trait of ours in recent years. That is somewhat forgivable when you take into account the inexperience of the side (in terms of them actually playing together), and obviously that key players such as Suarez and Lucas simply haven't had a proper pre-season.

It's disapointing in the manner the game turned out after such a bright opening but we all knew we had (and still do have) a hell of a lot of kinks to be sorted out.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 17:10
I was at the game yesterday, as I usually am, I have a pretty good view on the game and I am a bit of an analyst. The problem wasn't anything tactical yesterday in my view, first half we were brilliant, second, not so good, we simply just lost our way in the second half and we couldn't sustain the quality we showed in the first half, it's as simple as that mate. Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong, the players just didn't keep the quality up, that's football.

Wow that's a novel idea - blame the players and not the manager - I'll go with that:D The trouble is, we had begun to loose our way after 35mins or so - and that's worrying.

cravenz
14-8-11, 17:12
That's pretty much how I saw it. It's disapointing that we still see games like this because it's been something of a trait of ours for a while. Dominate the opening periods and go in front but then pay the price for not killing the game off by taking the chances we create. We were unfortunate to go in at half time only 1-0 up because with a little more luck we could (and should) have been 3 up. Had we got the second goal we deserved but still dropped off as we did in the second half, I think most would be saying Kenny got it right.

We just never really turned up in the second half, and failing to capitalise when we were on top is what ultimately cost us. Annoyingly we didn't respond once they equalised but again that is something of a trait of ours in recent years. That is somewhat forgivable when you take into account the inexperience of the side (in terms of them actually playing together), and obviously that key players such as Suarez and Lucas simply haven't had a proper pre-season.

It's disapointing in the manner the game turned out after such a bright opening but we all knew we had (and still do have) a hell of a lot of kinks to be sorted out.

Definitely agree with that though it is hard to stomach re: habits we can't seem to shake off. But hopefully we get things going soon and this comes with getting games together as a team as well. There were many positives that we could take from the game yesterday albeit the fact that I really was hoping we could take 3 points in light of our change in circumstances. We built ourselves (psychologically, for some fans and hoping for instand success) for a big start so the 'fall' is harder to take, I think.

Gazza74
14-8-11, 17:13
The trouble is, we had begun to loose our way after 35mins or so - and that's worrying.

It would be worrying if we didn't have a new manager and a whole load of new players making their debuts together and not even close to being gelled yet.

As it is, with a new manager in his first full season, a load of new players and fitness levels at varying degrees, it's to be expected that there'll be teething problems in matches early on in the season and maybe for a couple of months.

As it is, it's frustrating to see the dip in the 2nd half, but given these factors not to worrying at this stage, it would be moreso if we were a fully gelled team that the manager has had together for a year or more.

Captain Mauser
14-8-11, 17:14
Wow that's a novel idea - blame the players and not the manager - I'll go with that:D The trouble is, we had begun to loose our way after 35mins or so - and that's worrying.

It's something we could have done with a lot more 2 years ago when certain senior pros were a ******* disgrace to Rafa.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 17:15
That's pretty much how I saw it. It's disapointing that we still see games like this because it's been something of a trait of ours for a while. Dominate the opening periods and go in front but then pay the price for not killing the game off by taking the chances we create. We were unfortunate to go in at half time only 1-0 up because with a little more luck we could (and should) have been 3 up. Had we got the second goal we deserved but still dropped off as we did in the second half, I think most would be saying Kenny got it right. We just never really turned up in the second half, and failing to capitalise when we were on top is what ultimately cost us. Annoyingly we didn't respond once they equalised but again that is something of a trait of ours in recent years. That is somewhat forgivable when you take into account the inexperience of the side (in terms of them actually playing together), and obviously that key players such as Suarez and Lucas simply haven't had a proper pre-season. It's disapointing in the manner the game turned out after such a bright opening but we all knew we had (and still do have) a hell of a lot of kinks to be sorted out.

I agree Fios, but PL winners don't drop off. When we ran the Mancs close a couple of years ago, how many times did we come back from a goal or two down to win or grab a last-minute winner? We never looked like doing that yesterday.

cravenz
14-8-11, 17:16
It would be worrying if we didn't have a new manager and a whole load of new players making their debuts together and not even close to being gelled yet.

As it is, with a new manager in his first full season, a load of new players and fitness levels at varying degrees, it's to be expected that there'll be teething problems in matches early on in the season and maybe for a couple of months.

As it is, it's frustrating to see the dip in the 2nd half, but given these factors not to worrying at this stage, it would be moreso if we were a fully gelled team that the manager has had together for a year or more.

I'm going to be brutally honest here, but if anything, I'm still puzzled why we never really got our first team players more game time in friendlies (Hull it was I believe, please correct if I'm wrong), even if for 45 minutes, to learn to play with each other and for match sharpness. I'm just getting it off my chest really i.e. venting a little here.

Gazza74
14-8-11, 17:18
I agree Fios, but PL winners don't drop off. When we ran the Mancs close a couple of years ago, how many times did we come back from a goal or two down to win or grab a last-minute winner? We never looked like doing that yesterday.

We're not PL winners though.

We're in a rebuilding process to hopefully get back to being league winners and it doesn't just happen overnight that you get to that level.

That 08/09 team took Rafa 4 years to build and 4 years to get to the level of being able to do that type of thing on a regular basis.

Now, i'm not saying it'll take Kenny that long as he's got far better financial backing, but it'll take more than one game to get the team mentally strong and playing in the way that get's us wins consistently and pushes to the top of the league.

FIOS
14-8-11, 17:19
I agree Fios, but PL winners don't drop off. When we ran the Mancs close a couple of years ago, how many times did we come back from a goal or two down to win or grab a last-minute winner? We never looked like doing that yesterday.

We had a much better side that year but then our problem that season, aside from that cracking run in we had, was actually breaking teams down rather than throwing games away.

MickeyLove
14-8-11, 17:19
I'm hoping the drop off we saw might have been down to a lack of fitness. If so, then that is something that will certainly improve as the season progress'.

Gazza74
14-8-11, 17:22
I'm going to be brutally honest here, but if anything, I'm still puzzled why we never really got our first team players more game time in friendlies (Hull it was I believe, please correct if I'm wrong), even if for 45 minutes, to learn to play with each other and for match sharpness. I'm just getting it off my chest really i.e. venting a little here.

To be honest, it wouldn't have really made much difference anyway as friendlies don't replicate the intensity and speed of a competitive PL match.

It needs them to all play together in these league games and if we don't win some of them, well, it's something we have to go through in order to get where we want to be.

You can't ask a manager to rebuild and expect things to be perfect from day one, match one, it didn't happen with any of our previous 5 manager and it won't happen with Kenny.

We could still have a great season this season, but there was always going to be teething problems and issues with the team whilst Kenny rebuilt and let's not forget that we have him back as manager because we have major issues not because we're the best team around.

We'll get there, we just have to be patient and deal with the setbacks like yesterday, aslong as they don't come in droves like under Hodgson last season.

Kilokahn
14-8-11, 17:23
Ok, first thing i'll say is ALL managers make mistakes, get it wrong, possibly cost matches for their team, the greats do it to, Ferguson, hate him, but he is a great, does it, get his teams wrong and costs his side results, but he doesn't do it enough to cost them titles over 38 games.

Kenny IS a GREAT manager to, that isn't up for debate and he made mistakes, got things wrong, cost us points and baffled plenty the first time he was here.

By Christmas in 1985, his first spell as manager, many questioned if the club had got it wrong in appointing him player-manager and whether it was just to soon. We'd struggled a fair bit, he'd struggled and it wasn't looking like the Liverpool we'd been for 20 years.

But he rallied the troops, said that we needed to improve our away form, and after Christmas we went on a great run and ended up clinching the title on the last weekend, then went on to win the double. The rest for Kenny is history and had the terrible event of 1989 not happened he'd have won a lot more than his 3 league titles and many other trophies to IMO.

He made plenty of mistakes back then, baffled people with signings and team selections, had many scratching their heads after a draw or defeat, but like Ferguson, Kenny has genius and over a 42 or 38 games season he can get a hell of a lot more things right that mean we can be celebrating titles and trophies come May.

We've played one game, just one, and if we'd had a bit more luck in that excellent first half display we'd have been 3-0 up and would all be happy today instead of frustrated. Why we fell away in that 2nd half, who knows, but to make a judgement on his signings, on Kenny himself, on everything, based on just one game we didn't win is pretty stupid really.

One game gone, Kenny possibly made mistakes, but then again we should have been out of sight by half time and in that respect and the first half display Kenny got the team selection right in the main and it wasn't his fault we ended that half at only 1-0. The 2nd half he can be blamed for not changing it right or having the options on the bench, but again, had we been 3-0 up, as we should have been, it wouldn't have been needed.

I'm not sure what the OP is actually saying, is he saying he wants Kenny replaced?....It seems to infer that in the first post as he doesn't think Kenny is up to the job and has decided this after the summer signings and one league game we drew.

If he doesn't mean this i'd like to know what the tone of this thread is as he isn't just questioning Kenny for yesterday he seems to be questioning Kenny as manager. If so, what's his solution?..New manager?..If so who. Again, i'm not saying this is what the OP is saying, just the impression from some of the comments, they seem to intimate Kenny is the wrong man for the job and will always be.

My only response is what i've said above, it's one game and Kenny deserves more than one game in his first full season to prove himself 2nd time round. If you look right back to 1985 and the managers since Kenny, no manager has had an amazing first season without struggles.

I mentioned 85/86 above, which ended well, but didn't start great for Kenny. Souness was mediocre in 1991/92 in the league, Roy Evans did decent, but not spectacular during his first full season in 1994/95, Houllier finished 7th in his first full season that began with joint managership until early October, 4th when he was on his own in 99/00. Rafa didn't have a great first season in the league in 04/05 and failed to get in the top 4. Roy was just poor and got sacked in January.

All of them had struggles in their first full seasons and for differing reasons, but aside from Hodgson they all came through that first season and went on to be a lot better, in Kenny's case he was world class after his initial 5/6 months of struggle in 85/86.

My point is, all made mistakes, all made odd signings, all got poor results in their first season, but, all were allowed that first season bedding in and getting their football ideas across and especially if they've made a lot of changes to the team and squad which will always take time and have teething problems.

Kenny is a world class manager and we need to judge him over more than just one league game, a game that, yes, hasn't gone well, but is still only one game. Same with the new signings. They all looked good for 45 minutes yesterday and showed promise for when they gel further and intergrate further, so despite that 2nd half mystery we can be excited for me.

But again, with Kenny and with them, it's his and their first full season here and they need more than 1 game before being written off. Question Kenny, sure, for the one game yesterday, but bigger picture wise let's see how it pans out over the season before asking whether he's as good as the first time round and can take us back where he last had us.

He will make mistakes, he did make mistakes last time, all manager do, it isn't unique to Kenny. But what is unique to him, like with other great managers, is he can still win titles inspite of these mistakes and i believe this is still the case with him in the present day because you dont lose that genius and magic.

The OP may not have meant to but some of his comments suggest he may want Kenny replaced as he doesn't think he'll ever be the right manager and that is just silly after just one game in the league and a draw in it. Maybe wait to see what happens over the season and at least give Kenny a good batch of matches and see where we are then before making claims like this.

Kenny isn't perfect, he wasn't the first time round, but he is a winner and like all great manager and winners, he can overcome his inperfections and mistakes and win titles and trophies and i'll be shocked if he still can't do that now as he's older, more experienced and for me better than he was back in the 80s, so let's relax and give the man a chance to rebuild fully and get over the teething problems and mistakes that always come in a managers first full season.

It should also be noted that Ferguson began his managerial career with Man U at the same time as Kenny and has been there the whole time.
Kenny has had to undertake a massive rebuilding process as well.

FIOS
14-8-11, 17:26
I'm hoping the drop off we saw might have been down to a lack of fitness. If so, then that is something that will certainly improve as the season progress'.

Definitely. I think what we saw in the second half was more a reflection of our disjointed pre-season preperations.

I remembering either reading a comment or hearing it on one of the phone ins that Kenny seems to have spent the summer getting many of our players fit for other teams. Despite obviously being toungue in cheek, it was pretty appropriate.

cravenz
14-8-11, 17:29
To be honest, it wouldn't have really made much difference anyway as friendlies don't replicate the intensity and speed of a competitive PL match.

It needs them to all play together in these league games and if we don't win some of them, well, it's something we have to go through in order to get where we want to be.

You can't ask a manager to rebuild and expect things to be perfect from day one, match one, it didn't happen with any of our previous 5 manager and it won't happen with Kenny.

We could still have a great season this season, but there was always going to be teething problems and issues with the team whilst Kenny rebuilt and let's not forget that we have him back as manager because we have major issues not because we're the best team around.

We'll get there, we just have to be patient and deal with the setbacks like yesterday, aslong as they don't come in droves like under Hodgson last season.

Oh I agree with all that, that it will take time, said that in one of the threads just a few minutes back, or in this one. I know 45 minutes wouldn't be much and the easiest way to explain it away is that it wouldn't make much difference re: intensity and time. But playing against someone, with new players just to have a grasp of their playing style, in my opinion can do a world of good. I'm not saying by doing it, we would have won. But I would think, the players would get to know each other's game better. That said, I'm sure we do it in training. But because we didn't do it in the friendlies, it just nags away at me I suppose.

coachwatson
14-8-11, 17:58
Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong

Including Henderson over Kuyt?

LivingProof
14-8-11, 18:21
My main concern is Carroll, have nothing against the lad I just feel we play better football without him in the team. Proof is in the pudding with the form towards the end of last season. 4-3-3 free flowing quick football with Suarez, Maxi and Kuyt forming a good partnership.

With Carroll in the side, it seems play slows down and people forget how to play simple quick passes and resort to hollywood balls or hoofing it into the box. You'd think Carroll would score 80 goals a season from the posts of people on here, fitting the team to suit his play is wrong.

SIMPLYRED
14-8-11, 18:32
We're not PL winners though.We're in a rebuilding process to hopefully get back to being league winners and it doesn't just happen overnight that you get to that level.That 08/09 team took Rafa 4 years to build and 4 years to get to the level of being able to do that type of thing on a regular basis.Now, i'm not saying it'll take Kenny that long as he's got far better financial backing, but it'll take more than one game to get the team mentally strong and playing in the way that get's us wins consistently and pushes to the top of the league.

We're definitely not! But at least we consistently qualified for Europe and of course Istanbul helped. I'm concerned that, with Man City coming up and increasing the competition, we just don't have time and that yet another rebuilding exercise will see us dropping down the league and being unable to attract the players necessary to get us back to being serious PL challengers. I guess that our external sponsorship is also dependent on league position and European qualification.

Dynasty-inthe-Making
14-8-11, 19:43
What I would have liked to see yesterday in the 2nd half is to see 3 substitutions coming in:

- Kyut
- Maxi
- Aquilani

Those 3 as subs IMO would have made a difference especially in keeping the ball & building a pass & move attack that would have created more opportunities.

Why the last two haven't been included in the team is puzzling mainly because they've had a good pre-season run & under Kenny I heard many times by players playing under him say that no one gets an automatic chance to play unless they play well & prove worthy of being picked! If that is the case Aqua should have been a starter! Some say its debatable for him to start but I don't think its debatable for him not to be in the bench!

I'm glad that today some of the teams dropped points but I feel we have lost 2 points yesterday play at home we need to remedy that very quickly! A great start in our campaign is very crucial if I was Kenny I would have pulled the hairdryer yesterday after the game & I'm hoping that he did! :D

Seriously no more excuses this team is strong enough now get in their do your job!!!! :mad: This is Liverpool!!!! :mad: This is Anfield!!!! :mad:

I have no idea how my post ended up with a rant! :D
But there you go! :D

letsgoagain
14-8-11, 20:12
The weekness in his tactics is he plays attacking football and takes risks going forward but that is what you have to do to win the this league.

Getafe-My-Lawn!
14-8-11, 20:13
I would like to see Suarez play in the hole. He is our best player in tight spaces without doubt.

This would free up Carroll to play across the oppostion back line, I don't like it when Carroll comes deep. Also I would like Carroll to go to the near post sometimes when crosses are about to come in (Like that great header against Man City). He backs off to the back post and doesn't build up any momentum or loose his marker, he is a bit predictable.

Also, we need to move the ball alot quicker in the first two thirds of the pitch. Push the fullbacks on, spread the centre backs apart, and have midfielders that want to recieve the ball off the centre backs.

dvbdanvinbentley
14-8-11, 20:21
both our strikers are working hard,but luis may be at a tired level if even match fit.

carroll yet to hit form,yet to form partnership with saurez and have enough time with the team in matches.

both could be more clinical infront of goal,more movement from carroll and work harder for headers/accuracy of them Luis can improve a little with decision making and strike accuracy.

the rest of the team need to remember carroll has two good feet to strike the ball with!, some nicely passes low balls across the box to carrolls feet would get us goals just as easy as passing it to his head.

downing,kuyt,maxi,adam,aquilani will all get a handfull of goals aswell though.

Kloppette
14-8-11, 20:25
I was at the game yesterday, as I usually am, I have a pretty good view on the game and I am a bit of an analyst. The problem wasn't anything tactical yesterday in my view, first half we were brilliant, second, not so good, we simply just lost our way in the second half and we couldn't sustain the quality we showed in the first half, it's as simple as that mate. Far as I'm concerned, Kenny got it right, did nothing wrong, the players just didn't keep the quality up, that's football.

I agree with this, Tactically was fine in football terms. I'm not sure selection on the right was the best but Kenny puts every confidence in his players which is great, Then its down to them to perform.
Fitness and being a little unfamiliar with each other seemed to be the problem, we look good when we are on top of things though.

lauriantero
14-8-11, 20:47
My main concern is Carroll, have nothing against the lad I just feel we play better football without him in the team. Proof is in the pudding with the form towards the end of last season. 4-3-3 free flowing quick football with Suarez, Maxi and Kuyt forming a good partnership.

With Carroll in the side, it seems play slows down and people forget how to play simple quick passes and resort to hollywood balls or hoofing it into the box. You'd think Carroll would score 80 goals a season from the posts of people on here, fitting the team to suit his play is wrong.

We played some nice free flowing quick pass and move football in the first half with Carroll in the team. We started hoofing a bit in the second half as our passing deteriorated for some reason. It had nothing to do with Carroll, and blaming him for it lazy analysing and looking for scape goat.

We are not fitting our style of playing to accomodate Carroll, but we are using his strengths. Not using them would be stupid. But Carroll is not just a big man up front. He participates in the game quite a lot and his movement is good. He has a good technique and he can pass. But he's also a beast in the air, and I see no problem using that asset as well. Not by hoofing, but by getting quality crosses in to the box. It won't make us a long ball team. It just gives us options.

liverpoolsurfer
21-1-12, 13:15
Couldn't agree more. If he turns into a bust it will be because his teammates did not learn how to use him effectively. It won't be because of his ability.

a bkast from the past, but do you still feel this now, I vet some opinions have changes on this thread.

liverpoolsurfer
21-1-12, 13:18
Jeez, yet another clueless thread criticising the team and manager after one game. It's just getting boring now. Why not at least give Kenny 4-5 games before jumping to these sort of conclusions? He has won the title 4 times as a manager, so I think we can all be pretty confident that he knows what he's doing.

what is your opinion now?

liverpoolsurfer
21-1-12, 13:23
To be honest, I'm sick of seeing negative threads questioning the manager after only 1 game.

are you still sick off them after more than half a season?

Fizzle
21-1-12, 13:26
Why not just bump your own thread.

On a match day too. Very sad.

come on redmen some of us SUPPORT you.

liverpoolsurfer
21-1-12, 13:29
Why not just bump your own thread.

i think its good to look back at the past. I got slated for questioning KD after 1 match. now some off those who slated me are questioning KD. Just thought I would prove a small point, dont take offence.
I do support the team, bad timming. sorry to many beers!

kopernikus
21-1-12, 14:20
i think its good to look back at the past. I got slated for questioning KD after 1 match. now some off those who slated me are questioning KD. Just thought I would prove a small point, dont take offence.
I do support the team, bad timming. sorry to many beers!

So if we now go on a run of ten games where we batter everybody in sight, are you going to bump this thread again to prove something to everybody?

liverpoolsurfer
21-1-12, 21:44
So if we now go on a run of ten games where we batter everybody in sight, are you going to bump this thread again to prove something to everybody?

hate to say i told you so! maybe we will 9 in a row now.