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Thread: I don't feel we're getting the best out of Coutinho and it's concerning.

  1. #1 Philippe Coutinho I don't feel we're getting the best out of Coutinho and it's concerning. 
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    What's happened to him? His game has changed.

    This has been a subject that's been bothering me for a year now.

    If I remember correctly Coutinho (as well as others) played a pivotal part in our charge for the title in 2013/14. It's all well and good having a world class striker in Suarez and a top finisher in Sturridge, but they need supply. Coutinho back in those days was more focused on supplying our deadly strikers, he in particular seemed to have formed a relationship with Sturridge. He'd always seem to find him with an acute pass. He was more focused on key passes, rather than goals.

    These were the days of a Coutinho "The Key Master". Coutinho "The Playmaker". Coutinho "The Wizard". Now he's just Coutinho "I'll have a go from 40 yards and because I hit so many, one's gonna go in eventually" if there's space. There must be a stat out there of who takes the most long shots, he must be first on that list. I don't know that official count but he must have had at least 7 long shots at Turf Moor the other day.

    Now this isn't his doing, I firmly believe that the departure of Suarez and injury ridden Sturridge has forced him to change his game. We used to possess forwards who would make clever, darting runs. Suarez was so so clever, never not on the move. When Sturridge was playing up front, he played most of the time on the shoulder of the defender. Now he's acting as our deep lying playmaker?

    This change of game from Coutinho of course hasn't been help by the arrival of target men at this club, Balotelli, Lambert & Benteke. I actually rate Benteke as a striker, but he was never ever a fit for this club. As a club, we're not about long ball and crosses. It's always been pass and move. In the right environment, Benteke will flourish but in an environment like ours a target man's predominant weakness is shown. Appalling movement. No movement, no pass.

    We need to get Coutinho back to his playmaking best, because I just don't see him as playmaker anymore. But it may be too late, Coutinho may be set in the mindset that he's LFC's best player so he needs to make things happen by himself by scoring goals, but the shots that he takes are low percentage shots and sometimes there's a pass on which he ignores because of this state of mind.

    People bang on about Coutinho moving to a bigger club, but he'll never move to a bigger club if he doesn't get back to the Coutinho that shocked us when he arrived in January and turned our season around with Sturridge by putting life into a stagnate Liverpool attack.

    It's a shame because I doubt we'll ever see this Coutinho again, simply by the way we now play. He's out there, on the left hand side of Sturridge who either injured or deeper that Coutinho himself. Even if Origi was on the pitch, a player who's capable of playing on the shoulder, I feel like Coutinho would ignore chances to play a key pass. Firmino simply isn't the type to make runs in behind.

    I dunno, I just feel like we have inadvertently forced Coutinho into this long shot monster and it's not the way forward in my opinion. I would like him to get back to focusing on key passes, and not have a go every time there's space in front of him. But of course, I (we) don't know if he's being asked to play in this fashion.

    Who knows, but I would prefer this Coutinho back.
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  2. #2  
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    All of 8 days ago it was a Coutinho love in, this is his season, goals galore, what a player

    One game later this.

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    we have rarely had any movement in front of Coutinho in the past 2 seasons...plus we have played him further forward than we did in 13/14 so he has less options, that coupled with the fact he likely feels pressure to try to win us games because we haven't had enough goals in the side all contributes to this new Coutinho
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  4. #4  
    Liverdinner is online now Posts With His Faace
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    Quote Originally Posted by welshypool View Post
    All of 8 days ago it was a Coutinho love in, this is his season, goals galore, what a player

    One game later this.

    Did the OP say those things?

    Or are you grouping him in with people, something you accused others of doing in another thread.
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  5. #5  
    spider-neil is online now Academy prospect
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    His shots from the edge of the area are getting pretty ********** infuriating.
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  6. #6  
    MiraclesArePossible is online now Boot Room insider
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    Quote Originally Posted by welshypool View Post
    All of 8 days ago it was a Coutinho love in, this is his season, goals galore, what a player

    One game later this.

    Was the OP responsible for any of that 'love in' you just described? If not your post is just empty words.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liverdinner View Post
    Did the OP say those things?

    Or are you grouping him in with people, something you accused others of doing in another thread.
    Sorry have you just taken up being a mod?

    The content does seem to reflect more on the Burnley game overall though it alludes to overall performances at points but he was stunning against Arsenal from that position, produced moments of greatness a number of times from that position.

    Its not Coutinho that's the issue its what is around him, he can't reproduce magic every week so this relates more to Burnley aftermath for me
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    I think Coutinho has taken to heart, the comments of him having to take on Stevie G's mantle of carrying the team to success, which forces him to try and pull off dramatic winners all of the time.

    He needs to get that monkey off his back, and get on with his natural game - which includes long range shots "at the right moment", while 80% of the time creating opportunities for the rest of the team.
    I'm the normal one.
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  9. #9  
    KeepTheFightForJustice is offline Academy prospect
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    We're not getting the best out of Coutinho?

    Since Klopps been here he has been sensational apart from Burnley and the EL final...
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  10. #10  
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeepTheFightForJustice View Post
    We're not getting the best out of Coutinho?

    Since Klopps been here he has been sensational apart from Burnley and the EL final...
    He does take too many long shots - not just in those two games. That doesn't mean he hasn't been good - but this is a player who has the capability to be a world class player, which means making the right decisions more often than not.
    I'm the normal one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnfieldPoots View Post
    we have rarely had any movement in front of Coutinho in the past 2 seasons...plus we have played him further forward than we did in 13/14 so he has less options, that coupled with the fact he likely feels pressure to try to win us games because we haven't had enough goals in the side all contributes to this new Coutinho
    I think this is what's leading to so much of his inconsistency and desperation to make something happen. It also doesn't help that those in front of him are often very similar in style and tend to run between the lines rather than through them. It makes what movement we do have predictable and easier to close off.
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    Quote Originally Posted by welshypool View Post
    Sorry have you just taken up being a mod?

    The content does seem to reflect more on the Burnley game overall though it alludes to overall performances at points but he was stunning against Arsenal from that position, produced moments of greatness a number of times from that position.

    Its not Coutinho that's the issue its what is around him, he can't reproduce magic every week so this relates more to Burnley aftermath for me
    I see that excuse being used more and more.

    But for me, the sign of a real top player is one who performs to a high standard consistently, irrelevant of which club they play for and who their team mates are.

    Phillipe hasn't earned or shown enough consistently to earn a move to a top side as it stands, in my opinion.
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  13. #13  
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    Coutinho does tend to fall out of games quickly. Having said that he is integral to us going forward. I just don't think we get the best out of him with him on the left. He needs to be a traditional number 10.
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  14. #14  
    KeepTheFightForJustice is offline Academy prospect
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    Quote Originally Posted by scousechrisj View Post
    He does take too many long shots - not just in those two games. That doesn't mean he hasn't been good - but this is a player who has the capability to be a world class player, which means making the right decisions more often than not.
    Course he does, He just scored a screamer the week before. Confidence is sky high.

    He needs to know when to shoot and when not to, that's all.
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    I'd also like to see him playmaking between the lines again as he's quite wonderful when it comes to through balls.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bewdleyfan View Post
    I see that excuse being used more and more.

    But for me, the sign of a real top player is one who performs too a high standard consistently, irrelevant of which club they play for and who their team mates are.

    Phillipe hasn't earned or shown enough consistently to earn a move to a top side as it stands, in my opinion.
    I would go one step further and say this is why he and Firmino are in and out of a very poor Brazil national set-up. They are both inconsistent. When on song,brilliant. Need to seem them both up there every game. They have the ability.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeepTheFightForJustice View Post
    Course he does, He just scored a screamer the week before. Confidence is sky high.

    He needs to know when to shoot and when not to, that's all.
    That decision making is a massive component for him - for every long shot in row z, how many of these could have been an incisive pass (which he is very capable of).
    I'm the normal one.
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  18. #18  
    MiraclesArePossible is online now Boot Room insider
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    Quote Originally Posted by welshypool View Post
    Sorry have you just taken up being a mod?
    If pointing out the horse crap you post were part of the mods' job description they'd have to bring Matt back full time to deal with the overflow.
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    Coutinho was crap vs Burnley. The purpose of the midfield is to get the ball to our dangerous players in the final 3rd and Coutinho wasted about 7 opportunities on Saturday through poor shooting.

    I love the guy and he's got all the talent in the world - but he still needs to work on his decision making big time. What ****es me off was that Hendo was in the press last week saying how Coutinho was close to bridging the gap between himself, Ronaldo and Messi!

    He's our most exciting player but he's not World Class yet.
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  20. #20  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrams View Post
    I'd also like to see him playmaking between the lines again as he's quite wonderful when it comes to through balls.
    Yep. He is not a winger. He doesn't have explosive pace and beats players by going around them. He is far better coming in deep and flaying nice through balls to the front men.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klopphopper View Post
    I would go one step further and say this is why he and Firmino are in and out of a very poor Brazil national set-up. They are both inconsistent. When on song,brilliant. Need to seem them both up there every game. They have the ability.
    I'd agree with that.
    I'm the normal one.
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  22. #22  
    spider-neil is online now Academy prospect
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    Coutinho had a stand out game two weeks ago with 3 bits of magic that completely changed the course of the game. Had one moment of magic vs Manu when for the rest of the game he was frankly poor and in between has been off form for months. Yes, months.
    Last edited by spider-neil; 23-8-16 at 15:20.
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    He's playing wide left under Klopp now. Seems more direct and clinical than a creative playmaker.

    He's alright.
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  24. #24  
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    You see Coutinho exactly as I do , I'm his big fan since he arrived this club, his passing has been the joy to watch , we can still see his deadly passing occasionally , last Saturday he passed accurate long ball to Sturridge who could get it because he was too slow . I think Coutinho's recent playing pattern has been affected by Klopp's tactic .

    Quote Originally Posted by Batteries View Post
    What's happened to him? His game has changed.

    This has been a subject that's been bothering me for a year now.

    If I remember correctly Coutinho (as well as others) played a pivotal part in our charge for the title in 2013/14. It's all well and good having a world class striker in Suarez and a top finisher in Sturridge, but they need supply. Coutinho back in those days was more focused on supplying our deadly strikers, he in particular seemed to have formed a relationship with Sturridge. He'd always seem to find him with an acute pass. He was more focused on key passes, rather than goals.

    These were the days of a Coutinho "The Key Master". Coutinho "The Playmaker". Coutinho "The Wizard". Now he's just Coutinho "I'll have a go from 40 yards and because I hit so many, one's gonna go in eventually" if there's space. There must be a stat out there of who takes the most long shots, he must be first on that list. I don't know that official count but he must have had at least 7 long shots at Turf Moor the other day.

    Now this isn't his doing, I firmly believe that the departure of Suarez and injury ridden Sturridge has forced him to change his game. We used to possess forwards who would make clever, darting runs. Suarez was so so clever, never not on the move. When Sturridge was playing up front, he played most of the time on the shoulder of the defender. Now he's acting as our deep lying playmaker?

    This change of game from Coutinho of course hasn't been help by the arrival of target men at this club, Balotelli, Lambert & Benteke. I actually rate Benteke as a striker, but he was never ever a fit for this club. As a club, we're not about long ball and crosses. It's always been pass and move. In the right environment, Benteke will flourish but in an environment like ours a target man's predominant weakness is shown. Appalling movement. No movement, no pass.

    We need to get Coutinho back to his playmaking best, because I just don't see him as playmaker anymore. But it may be too late, Coutinho may be set in the mindset that he's LFC's best player so he needs to make things happen by himself by scoring goals, but the shots that he takes are low percentage shots and sometimes there's a pass on which he ignores because of this state of mind.

    People bang on about Coutinho moving to a bigger club, but he'll never move to a bigger club if he doesn't get back to the Coutinho that shocked us when he arrived in January and turned our season around with Sturridge by putting life into a stagnate Liverpool attack.

    It's a shame because I doubt we'll ever see this Coutinho again, simply by the way we now play. He's out there, on the left hand side of Sturridge who either injured or deeper that Coutinho himself. Even if Origi was on the pitch, a player who's capable of playing on the shoulder, I feel like Coutinho would ignore chances to play a key pass. Firmino simply isn't the type to make runs in behind.

    I dunno, I just feel like we have inadvertently forced Coutinho into this long shot monster and it's not the way forward in my opinion. I would like him to get back to focusing on key passes, and not have a go every time there's space in front of him. But of course, I (we) don't know if he's being asked to play in this fashion.

    Who knows, but I would prefer this Coutinho back.
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  25. #25  
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    He's as inconsistent as the team.
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    Coutinho has always looked better and more dangerous playing a little bit deeper and through the middle. Funny that we screaming out for a new CM who can playmake. A bit mad really.
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  27. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by theamerican00 View Post
    Coutinho has always looked better and more dangerous playing a little bit deeper and through the middle. Funny that we screaming out for a new CM who can playmake. A bit mad really.
    Ive mentioned Coutinho CM a few times, he'd be better than Wij there thats for sure though I think his slight frame wouldn't do him any favours in the prem. Modoric has come into his own playing CM in spain but here I always saw him a better ACM due to the fact he got bullied a fair bit in CM.
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  28. #28  
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    His best has come when he was playing in a midfield 3 where he was getting on the ball earlier and playmaking.

    I would not be as upset with our midfield if it looked like this


    Can
    Coutinho--Wijnaldum

    Coutinho when dictating play is amazing, he releases the ball so fast when he is deeper because teams cant react to him.
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  29. #29  
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    He spent the whole Burnley game being a CM anyway. Even if his actual position is wide left, he was dropping into midfield all game and getting on the ball.

    That was one of our biggest problems, because Sturridge was doing the same. So we had nobody to beat players one on one out wide.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aGothAndaJock View Post
    Coutinho was crap vs Burnley. The purpose of the midfield is to get the ball to our dangerous players in the final 3rd and Coutinho wasted about 7 opportunities on Saturday through poor shooting.

    I love the guy and he's got all the talent in the world - but he still needs to work on his decision making big time. What ****es me off was that Hendo was in the press last week saying how Coutinho was close to bridging the gap between himself, Ronaldo and Messi!

    He's our most exciting player but he's not World Class yet.
    Because he was getting the ball far to slow. By the time he got it burnley were set so Coutinho had no options. When he is shooting too much it is normally a sign that the tactics arnt working.
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