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Thread: Donald Trump POTUS...still...?

  1. #1771  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    And now he's blaming PR for wanting aide. 85% still without electricity. 1/3 without access to clean water. IT'S A US TERRORITY AND THESE ARE US CITIZENS.

    Imagaine if this was Ohio, and he said 'FEMA and help can't stay there forever. Here's some predatory loans to help you rebuild.'
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  2. #1772  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    Also, while doing that interview on a military base, Retreat was played. Retreat is where they lower the flag at the end of the day. Soliders stand and honor the lowering, then the second verse is played and soliders salute as it's folded.

    You're supposed to stand to honor it. He did not. He said it was music for Hannity's ratings. (also he doesn't put his hand over his heart when the National Anthem is played.) It's almost like, and I know this is a major shock, he doesn't actually care about the flag and merely is using it to divide the country, rally his white nationalist base, and oppress PoC.
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  3. #1773  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    And now Trump has signed an EO to further try and kill ACA because he has no clue about anything.

    Bring in the Junk Insurance companies to spike premiums and not help the sick. Trumpcare, folks.
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  4. #1774  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    President Deals does it again, signing an EO which will increase the deficit, hike up premiums, and lower the quality of health insurance.
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  5. #1775  
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    Quote Originally Posted by lfcstlouis View Post
    President Deals does it again, signing an EO which will increase the deficit, hike up premiums, and lower the quality of health insurance.
    It's been a rough couple of days for America. This plus his stance on the Iran deal and NAFTA are staggeringly bad decisions.
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  6. #1776  
    TheSoundLady is offline Optimistic Poster of the Season 2013-14
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    Quote Originally Posted by lfcstlouis View Post
    And now Trump has signed an EO to further try and kill ACA because he has no clue about anything.

    Bring in the Junk Insurance companies to spike premiums and not help the sick. Trumpcare, folks.
    Don't be fooled. Trump has every clue what he is doing. He and the men behind him are geniuses of manipulation. They want you to think they're idiots. The entire left wing has been fooled into thinking the leaders of the right are idiots. The followers of the right have very questionable views, yes, but the leaders of the right are the geniuses that invent and engineer those views. They are many things, most or all of them negative and bad... but stupid is not one of those things. There's a reason Reagan, Bush Jr and Trump all came across as extremely stupid. Because stupid sells (to the right wing) and stupid is also hard to blame. Much better that the left think you are stupid, than the left think you are manipulative, evil, and all-powerful.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSoundLady View Post
    Don't be fooled. Trump has every clue what he is doing. He and the men behind him are geniuses of manipulation. They want you to think they're idiots. The entire left wing has been fooled into thinking the leaders of the right are idiots. The followers of the right have very questionable views, yes, but the leaders of the right are the geniuses that invent and engineer those views. They are many things, most or all of them negative and bad... but stupid is not one of those things. There's a reason Reagan, Bush Jr and Trump all came across as extremely stupid. Because stupid sells (to the right wing) and stupid is also hard to blame. Much better that the left think you are stupid, than the left think you are manipulative, evil, and all-powerful.
    Absolutely - look at the news - Trump has apparently left the USA more isolated - that is by design, it is not the actions of idiots..... even though he acts like it...
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  8. #1778  
    naturalskill is online now First team regular
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    Trump's latest propaganda speech demonstrates beyond doubt that he is nothing more than an Israeli mouthpiece...a puppet for the financier oligarchy continuing their "axis of evil" agenda!
    A two-faced lying crook serving not the American people but the big corporate multi-nationals and the ultra-profitable war machine of western imperialism!
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  9. #1779  
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSoundLady View Post
    Don't be fooled. Trump has every clue what he is doing. He and the men behind him are geniuses of manipulation. They want you to think they're idiots. The entire left wing has been fooled into thinking the leaders of the right are idiots. The followers of the right have very questionable views, yes, but the leaders of the right are the geniuses that invent and engineer those views. They are many things, most or all of them negative and bad... but stupid is not one of those things. There's a reason Reagan, Bush Jr and Trump all came across as extremely stupid. Because stupid sells (to the right wing) and stupid is also hard to blame. Much better that the left think you are stupid, than the left think you are manipulative, evil, and all-powerful.
    I think you're giving Trump way too much credit. A case of attributing to malice what can easily be explained by stupidity. He's not a complete moron, but he's no Machiavelli either.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortigen View Post
    I think you're giving Trump way too much credit. A case of attributing to malice what can easily be explained by stupidity. He's not a complete moron, but he's no Machiavelli either.
    A sentence which neatly describes 98%* of the posts in this thread..

    *Note: 98% is not empirical - more of a guess really.. of course there is no way I could possibly read them all.. to deliberately expose myself to countless hate-filled, unobjective, hyperbole and faux-outrage would be much too much even for my thick skin - not to mention the ever-present, mind-numbing echo - which would see me throw-up, probably over some innocent Rosock post floating harmlessly toward the 'Ignore' section - now that's something I wouldn't want on my conscience!..

    FWIW - Trump is doing just fine.. his base is intact.. He's forcing Congress to do it's job.. and Russia is even less conspicuous than Matt Damon right now..

    Oh, and the Democrats, Hollywood, Media and co. are becoming more irrelevant each passing day.. Seriously - what even is their strategy?..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    A sentence which neatly describes 98%* of the posts in this thread..

    *Note: 98% is not empirical - more of a guess really.. of course there is no way I could possibly read them all.. to deliberately expose myself to countless hate-filled, unobjective, hyperbole and faux-outrage would be much too much even for my thick skin - not to mention the ever-present, mind-numbing echo - which would see me throw-up, probably over some innocent Rosock post floating harmlessly toward the 'Ignore' section - now that's something I wouldn't want on my conscience!..

    FWIW - Trump is doing just fine.. his base is intact.. He's forcing Congress to do it's job.. and Russia is even less conspicuous than Matt Damon right now..

    Oh, and the Democrats, Hollywood, Media and co. are becoming more irrelevant each passing day.. Seriously - what even is their strategy?..
    The Democrats may as well not exist for all the relevance they're having right now.

    I disagree with you on the Russia investigation though. It's not commanding as much media attention as a few months ago, but there are a few very interesting threads there for those keeping tabs on it.

    Mind you, I was never of the opinion that it would lead to impeachment or anything of the sort. What I want out of it is a masssive crackdown on dark money in elections, and I also want the Trump administration to recognize that the greatest threat to American national security is in the area of cyber and information warfare. Russia, China, and North Korea are all miles ahead of US in this department.

    As for Trump doing "fine", I guess it depends what you mean by that. Being forced to govern by executive order is not doing fine in my opinion. Neither is distabilizing insurance markets, trade agreements, treaties, and alliances.

    He is, however, doing an amazing job destroying the traditional Republican Party and turning it into the White Nationalist Party, in which Donald Trump is second fiddle to Steve Bannon. President or no. We'll see how things go in 2018 but early signs are very good for Bannon and terrifying for America.
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    Agreed on the Russia issue as only recently announced that about a hundred thousand dollars of ads were brought during the US election period by sources associated with the Kremlin. This mirrors what Facebook announced.

    Now this is nowhere near the smoking gun of collusion. Nor did the ads endorse a particular politician/party but they did use it to highlight particular issues that would make the recipient more amenable to one side over the other.
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul143 View Post
    Agreed on the Russia issue as only recently announced that about a hundred thousand dollars of ads were brought during the US election period by sources associated with the Kremlin. This mirrors what Facebook announced.

    Now this is nowhere near the smoking gun of collusion. Nor did the ads endorse a particular politician/party but they did use it to highlight particular issues that would make the recipient more amenable to one side over the other.
    It wouldn't be appropriate to look at any single prong of Russian active measures in isolation. They engaged in a multidimensional attack, the complete consequences of which, if known, will not be declassified for a long time.

    Further, Muller's investigation is no longer solely focused on Russia. It is presently as much about obstruction and cover up as anything else.
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  14. #1784  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortigen View Post
    The Democrats may as well not exist for all the relevance they're having right now.

    I disagree with you on the Russia investigation though. It's not commanding as much media attention as a few months ago, but there are a few very interesting threads there for those keeping tabs on it.

    Mind you, I was never of the opinion that it would lead to impeachment or anything of the sort. What I want out of it is a masssive crackdown on dark money in elections, and I also want the Trump administration to recognize that the greatest threat to American national security is in the area of cyber and information warfare. Russia, China, and North Korea are all miles ahead of US in this department.

    As for Trump doing "fine", I guess it depends what you mean by that. Being forced to govern by executive order is not doing fine in my opinion. Neither is distabilizing insurance markets, trade agreements, treaties, and alliances.

    He is, however, doing an amazing job destroying the traditional Republican Party and turning it into the White Nationalist Party, in which Donald Trump is second fiddle to Steve Bannon. President or no. We'll see how things go in 2018 but early signs are very good for Bannon and terrifying for America.
    Dangerous times for the Democrats - they should stop the pathetic posturing and do what's best for the country, not themselves.. It's pretty clear they believed the 'resist and protest' tactic would destroy Trump - it's not going to happen!.. his base is firm and may even be growing.. Conversely, it's also a dangerous time for many Republicans as they could soon be pushed out by pro-Trump candidates - especially the ones perceived to be hindering his policies..

    The 'Investigation' has one rather large, inherent, flaw - the main premise is complete and utter nonsense!.. I've said it from day one - if they had anything at all, Trump would be impeached already.. The only reason I can see for the 'investigation' continuing is that it still damages him, even if it reduces to next to nothing, some will go on believing regardless.. What's the old saying? - absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.. Catch 22!..

    Yes, I think he is doing fine.. He may be using EO to force things through, but his base understand that its Congress and the Senate who are responsible, not Trump.. I think it actually empowers Trump, a bit like the monster in the Superman film - the harder you hit it the bigger and stronger it becomes.. the more they attack Trump the more the belief in the narrative 'establishment against the little guy' grows, and the more resolute they will be..

    White Nationalist?.. Really?.. He is pro-American - ANY American.. He has said it, ad nauseum, for the past two years.. Groups can spin their preferred narrative any which way they want, but they are free to lie - facts do not..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    Dangerous times for the Democrats - they should stop the pathetic posturing and do what's best for the country, not themselves.. It's pretty clear they believed the 'resist and protest' tactic would destroy Trump - it's not going to happen!.. his base is firm and may even be growing.. Conversely, it's also a dangerous time for many Republicans as they could soon be pushed out by pro-Trump candidates - especially the ones perceived to be hindering his policies..

    The 'Investigation' has one rather large, inherent, flaw - the main premise is complete and utter nonsense!.. I've said it from day one - if they had anything at all, Trump would be impeached already.. The only reason I can see for the 'investigation' continuing is that it still damages him, even if it reduces to next to nothing, some will go on believing regardless.. What's the old saying? - absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.. Catch 22!..

    Yes, I think he is doing fine.. He may be using EO to force things through, but his base understand that its Congress and the Senate who are responsible, not Trump.. I think it actually empowers Trump, a bit like the monster in the Superman film - the harder you hit it the bigger and stronger it becomes.. the more they attack Trump the more the belief in the narrative 'establishment against the little guy' grows, and the more resolute they will be..

    White Nationalist?.. Really?.. He is pro-American - ANY American.. He has said it, ad nauseum, for the past two years.. Groups can spin their preferred narrative any which way they want, but they are free to lie - facts do not..
    Bit pathetic depending on your political opponents to bale you out, when you have government overflowing to the brim with people on your own side. (They are on his side aren't they? If not why not?)

    His base is firm? So what. Let him drive ACA in to the ground. Let him deliver on the coal jobs or their replacement. Let him build that wall and get Mexico to pay. His base will either stand firm because they deserve each other or they'll hoist him from a gibbet for being a snake-oil salesman.

    Democrats just need to say Republicans and Trump control everything. Remind Trump of his own words on his electoral majority. Why the hell does this superman need democrats?

    In your mind, how many and which things is he allowed to fail to deliver on before it's actually his fault? (Genuine question for the record)

    He was found guilty of racial equality breaches in his past, as a landlord. Twice I think. So facts on pro any American to match that? (Genuine question. Not saying there aren't any. I'm not aware of any)

    Edit: Re: 'Guilty': Not accurate; His company acknowledge the charges by changing their policies but only after an aggressive period of defence and a judge telling them they didn't have a case.
    Last edited by Luises-Finger; 15-10-17 at 17:49.
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    Yep, he stands for all Americans, unless you're black and want to protest police brutality, then you become a son of a you know what, or unless you're a black president and he doubts you are really American, or you're black and didn't rape a jogger in Central Park, or unless you're gay and he wants to please the Values Voters Summit, or if you're transgender and want to serve in the Armed Forces, or if you're protesting against neo-Confederates and neo-Nazis, or if you're a judge whose ancestry he doesn't trust, or a woman who catches his eye and has genitalia within arm's reach, or a POW......
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post

    White Nationalist?.. Really?.. He is pro-American - ANY American.. He has said it, ad nauseum, for the past two years.. Groups can spin their preferred narrative any which way they want, but they are free to lie - facts do not..
    You and I have had this discussion before, and it didn't go anywhere helpful. If your own life experiences haven't done anything to make you sensitive to racism, there isn't anything I can do either. I'll still share with you some of my own experiences that may at least help you see where I'm coming from.

    I grew up in Glasgow and then parts of Eastern Europe where race wasn't really a factor in life. Other things mattered more. Later on, I moved to America, and as I met people of various races and creeds I quickly noticed that my views on race and racism were a bit naive. Later still, while working in North Africa, I met a girl, who wasn't white. We eventually got engaged, and she moved with me to the US. It is by experiencing this country by her side that I realized just how tone deaf and plain idiotic I was when it came to the issue of race in America.

    You and I can talk about racism all we want, but to us it's just a concept. We will never, ever understand it the way my wife does. Every human interaction she will ever have is in one way or another touched by it. And the same goes for every non-white person in America and other countries built on white culture.

    I'll give you a silly example. I was reading the 11.22.63 novel by Stephen King not too long ago. There is time travel in it. The main character travels to 1958, which King described with an incredible sense of nostalgia. It made me wish I was there, and I told my wife as much before I really thought about it. Then it occurred to me that living in 1958 America is about as unappealing as it gets if you're black. Time travel is a white fantasy.

    In fact, if you're black and living in America, 2008 is probably the only year you'd feel good time traveling to. And you'd only want to stay a short while because Barack Obama wasn't in office very long before the current president started calling his citizenship into question. I recall you previously saying that it was appropriate to question "Barry's" citizenship. Well, it isn't. Had he been white and actually called Barry, no one would have questioned it. Even Trump would have found something else to pick on. But here was a black guy called Barack Hussein Obama. How can he possibly be American and a Christian with a name like that?

    To you birtherism isn't racist. And I would probably have had a different reaction to it 20 or 25 years ago. But instead I got to watch my wife deal with it. And she is not the sensitive type either. She's had a very tough life and has lived through more **** than most people will go through in 10 lifetimes. Yet here she was visibly affected by what this man is spewing. Not because she has any particular love for Barack Obama, but because she's been hearing the same story her whole life, and being the most powerful man in the world is apparently not enough to save you from it. And how did Obama have to react to it? Did he have the privilege to get angry? Did he have the privilege to take to social media and scream ****** murder the way our current president does about every *********** thing? No, he did not.
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  18. #1788  
    TheSoundLady is offline Optimistic Poster of the Season 2013-14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortigen View Post
    I think you're giving Trump way too much credit. A case of attributing to malice what can easily be explained by stupidity. He's not a complete moron, but he's no Machiavelli either.
    That's exactly what the powers that be want you to think

    So the masses all think that Trump is stupid. And there he is, the President and one of the richest men in the country too.

    Trump comes across as stupid because his scripted persona requires him to. If he acts stupid, then the powers that be can get away with anything, which is either excused by - or distracted from by - more Trump loud-mouth stupidity.

    As if every last movement isn't carefully tailored and planned to make us think whatever it is we think.

    I don't expect anyone to agree with me. These people are a hell of a lot more convincing and all-encompassing than any lone voice that contradicts the narrative. That's why they keep winning and will always win it seems.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortigen View Post
    You and I have had this discussion before, and it didn't go anywhere helpful. If your own life experiences haven't done anything to make you sensitive to racism, there isn't anything I can do either. I'll still share with you some of my own experiences that may at least help you see where I'm coming from.

    I grew up in Glasgow and then parts of Eastern Europe where race wasn't really a factor in life. Other things mattered more. Later on, I moved to America, and as I met people of various races and creeds I quickly noticed that my views on race and racism were a bit naive. Later still, while working in North Africa, I met a girl, who wasn't white. We eventually got engaged, and she moved with me to the US. It is by experiencing this country by her side that I realized just how tone deaf and plain idiotic I was when it came to the issue of race in America.

    You and I can talk about racism all we want, but to us it's just a concept. We will never, ever understand it the way my wife does. Every human interaction she will ever have is in one way or another touched by it. And the same goes for every non-white person in America and other countries built on white culture.

    I'll give you a silly example. I was reading the 11.22.63 novel by Stephen King not too long ago. There is time travel in it. The main character travels to 1958, which King described with an incredible sense of nostalgia. It made me wish I was there, and I told my wife as much before I really thought about it. Then it occurred to me that living in 1958 America is about as unappealing as it gets if you're black. Time travel is a white fantasy.

    In fact, if you're black and living in America, 2008 is probably the only year you'd feel good time traveling to. And you'd only want to stay a short while because Barack Obama wasn't in office very long before the current president started calling his citizenship into question. I recall you previously saying that it was appropriate to question "Barry's" citizenship. Well, it isn't. Had he been white and actually called Barry, no one would have questioned it. Even Trump would have found something else to pick on. But here was a black guy called Barack Hussein Obama. How can he possibly be American and a Christian with a name like that?

    To you birtherism isn't racist. And I would probably have had a different reaction to it 20 or 25 years ago. But instead I got to watch my wife deal with it. And she is not the sensitive type either. She's had a very tough life and has lived through more **** than most people will go through in 10 lifetimes. Yet here she was visibly affected by what this man is spewing. Not because she has any particular love for Barack Obama, but because she's been hearing the same story her whole life, and being the most powerful man in the world is apparently not enough to save you from it. And how did Obama have to react to it? Did he have the privilege to get angry? Did he have the privilege to take to social media and scream ****** murder the way our current president does about every *********** thing? No, he did not.
    Typically, thought provoking, Vortigen, and the central premise is right in the respect that I can't fully understand another's experience if I haven't experienced it for myself - but this is the crux.. It isn't only blacks people that suffer discrimination.. lots of groups in society do..

    To give an example - what is the prevailing view of Scousers in the UK? - thieves, lazy, benefit scroungers.. Are some like that? - of course, but we all get tarred with the same brush no matter our personal circumstances.. do you not think it possible a potential employer would choose the non-Scouse candidate because he doesn't care for the accent or maybe believes the stereotypes?.. is this really much different from a Black candidate?.. the outcome would be the same.. do you see protest groups and affirmative action for poor Scousers who, due to nothing more than a generalisation, are negatively stereotyped?.. No, of course not - we get on with it.. You could apply this bias to just about any area of life - . Surely the offence is in the perception of the person offended?.. The Black versus White dichotomy is just another example of bias whether implicit or explicit, but it is not the only one, and for lots of people it wouldn't even be the most important one - but it gets the most attention and resources..

    It just seems to me that the politics of victimhood is poison - it affects everything it touches and the people who believe it become more entrenched in it every day, oftentimes despite the reality.. It doesn't offer any answers, just increasingly crazy demands like reparations and affirmative action which only serves to increase divisions..

    Back to the US - during his campaign, Trump said at every rally - no matter where it was or who was in attendance that he wanted to sort out the inner-cities, the ghettos, to give hope back to the good, law-abiding people that live there.. He gave positive examples of how that might be achieved - increased policing, better schools, more funding - if my memory serves me correctly he even created new roles and appointed people to the task.. He said it was a national scandal that theses areas (virtually all in Democrat strongholds) had been allowed to deteriorate in this way.. Now, how in the hell can anyone turn that into a Trump is racist narrative?.. What more could he have said or done?.. To my mind, the Democrats are the ones culpable for the race divide in the US - do they do it deliberately?.. There are a plethora of Black hosted YouTube channels that are disgusted with the policies of the Democrat authorities in these areas - I have not seen it personally so I can only take them at their word - one thing is for sure, I can't find any channels of Black folk saying these areas provide a positive life experience..

    So where does that leave us?.. Do you not think that the Black experience would be improved by sorting out these areas?.. Do you not think that the current image of the typical Black, male youth would change if he stayed at school, got a job, married his girlfriend and raised his children using himself as a positive role model?.. I understand slavery will always be the elephant in the room, but it will always be there, nobody can change history.. You can change your future though..

    The Birtherism debate is old news.. There was a genuine doubt as to Obama's place of birth, he spent large portions of his life outside of the US and given that the rules are very clear if one wants to become President of the United Sates, I think the queries were probably justified.. Sure, his race may have been a factor, but the fact that some conspiracy nuts are not satisfied is to be expected.. There are plenty of conspiracy nuts right now who believe that Trump is being controlled by Putin, or that he is a card-carrying member of the KKK, and even one that he enjoys golden showers from prostitutes at Moscow hotels.. Ban the internet, I say!..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    Typically, thought provoking, Vortigen, and the central premise is right in the respect that I can't fully understand another's experience if I haven't experienced it for myself - but this is the crux.. It isn't only blacks people that suffer discrimination.. lots of groups in society do..

    To give an example - what is the prevailing view of Scousers in the UK? - thieves, lazy, benefit scroungers.. Are some like that? - of course, but we all get tarred with the same brush no matter our personal circumstances.. do you not think it possible a potential employer would choose the non-Scouse candidate because he doesn't care for the accent or maybe believes the stereotypes?.. is this really much different from a Black candidate?.. the outcome would be the same.. do you see protest groups and affirmative action for poor Scousers who, due to nothing more than a generalisation, are negatively stereotyped?.. No, of course not - we get on with it.. You could apply this bias to just about any area of life - . Surely the offence is in the perception of the person offended?.. The Black versus White dichotomy is just another example of bias whether implicit or explicit, but it is not the only one, and for lots of people it wouldn't even be the most important one - but it gets the most attention and resources..

    It just seems to me that the politics of victimhood is poison - it affects everything it touches and the people who believe it become more entrenched in it every day, oftentimes despite the reality.. It doesn't offer any answers, just increasingly crazy demands like reparations and affirmative action which only serves to increase divisions..

    Back to the US - during his campaign, Trump said at every rally - no matter where it was or who was in attendance that he wanted to sort out the inner-cities, the ghettos, to give hope back to the good, law-abiding people that live there.. He gave positive examples of how that might be achieved - increased policing, better schools, more funding - if my memory serves me correctly he even created new roles and appointed people to the task.. He said it was a national scandal that theses areas (virtually all in Democrat strongholds) had been allowed to deteriorate in this way.. Now, how in the hell can anyone turn that into a Trump is racist narrative?.. What more could he have said or done?.. To my mind, the Democrats are the ones culpable for the race divide in the US - do they do it deliberately?.. There are a plethora of Black hosted YouTube channels that are disgusted with the policies of the Democrat authorities in these areas - I have not seen it personally so I can only take them at their word - one thing is for sure, I can't find any channels of Black folk saying these areas provide a positive life experience..

    So where does that leave us?.. Do you not think that the Black experience would be improved by sorting out these areas?.. Do you not think that the current image of the typical Black, male youth would change if he stayed at school, got a job, married his girlfriend and raised his children using himself as a positive role model?.. I understand slavery will always be the elephant in the room, but it will always be there, nobody can change history.. You can change your future though..

    The Birtherism debate is old news.. There was a genuine doubt as to Obama's place of birth, he spent large portions of his life outside of the US and given that the rules are very clear if one wants to become President of the United Sates, I think the queries were probably justified.. Sure, his race may have been a factor, but the fact that some conspiracy nuts are not satisfied is to be expected.. There are plenty of conspiracy nuts right now who believe that Trump is being controlled by Putin, or that he is a card-carrying member of the KKK, and even one that he enjoys golden showers from prostitutes at Moscow hotels.. Ban the internet, I say!..
    Vortigen says you will never understand racism yet you go on to compare it to the treatment of scousers...no words...
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeemI View Post
    Vortigen says you will never understand racism yet you go on to compare it to the treatment of scousers...no words...
    Lol - I knew this was coming.. because naturally, nobody else's offence is comparable, right?.. like I said, offence is purely the perception of the offended, so who are you, I, or anyone else to compare what offends people or how deeply?..

    This the problem with victimhood in a nutshell..

    By any measure, we live in the most liberal, and tolerant society in the history of the world - which ironically, is exactly why victimhood is an issue - it really shouldn't be..
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    So being called lazy and jobless can be compared to being called a monkey? Have you had bananas put by your pillow or people trying their hardest not to let their skin touch yours?

    I am a Black African who grew up in Western Europe and experienced all these first hand.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeemI View Post
    So being called lazy and jobless can be compared to being called a monkey? Have you had bananas put by your pillow or people trying their hardest not to let their skin touch yours?

    I am a Black African who grew up in Western Europe and experienced all these first hand.
    Well, in that context the words 'thief' and 'monkey' are both words used to cause offence.. My point is that one group can't claim their experience is worse than any other, as the offence caused can only be measured by the offended..

    As for your last point, if I, a white male, lived in , say Gabon, I'd suggest my friends would be mostly the people I shared most in common with, and my experience might not be too dissimilar from yours - this is known as in-group preference and is one of the most basic of human instincts - being black, white, yellow or green has no bearing..

    This is all miles from topic though.. I said that Trump is not racist and during his rallies he consistently made the point that he wants to fix the inner-cities and give people a chance in life.. I hope congress will back him on this..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    A sentence which neatly describes 98%* of the posts in this thread..

    *Note: 98% is not empirical - more of a guess really.. of course there is no way I could possibly read them all.. to deliberately expose myself to countless hate-filled, unobjective, hyperbole and faux-outrage would be much too much even for my thick skin - not to mention the ever-present, mind-numbing echo - which would see me throw-up, probably over some innocent Rosock post floating harmlessly toward the 'Ignore' section - now that's something I wouldn't want on my conscience!..

    FWIW - Trump is doing just fine.. his base is intact.. He's forcing Congress to do it's job.. and Russia is even less conspicuous than Matt Damon right now..

    Oh, and the Democrats, Hollywood, Media and co. are becoming more irrelevant each passing day.. Seriously - what even is their strategy?..
    Aww poor little snowflake.
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    Bernie Sanders commenting on the Budget Proposals.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...bernie-sanders
    Eat. Sleep. Rave. Repeat.
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  26. #1796  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    Dangerous times for the Democrats - they should stop the pathetic posturing and do what's best for the country, not themselves.. It's pretty clear they believed the 'resist and protest' tactic would destroy Trump - it's not going to happen!.. his base is firm and may even be growing.. Conversely, it's also a dangerous time for many Republicans as they could soon be pushed out by pro-Trump candidates - especially the ones perceived to be hindering his policies..

    The 'Investigation' has one rather large, inherent, flaw - the main premise is complete and utter nonsense!.. I've said it from day one - if they had anything at all, Trump would be impeached already.. The only reason I can see for the 'investigation' continuing is that it still damages him, even if it reduces to next to nothing, some will go on believing regardless.. What's the old saying? - absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.. Catch 22!..

    Yes, I think he is doing fine.. He may be using EO to force things through, but his base understand that its Congress and the Senate who are responsible, not Trump.. I think it actually empowers Trump, a bit like the monster in the Superman film - the harder you hit it the bigger and stronger it becomes.. the more they attack Trump the more the belief in the narrative 'establishment against the little guy' grows, and the more resolute they will be..

    White Nationalist?.. Really?.. He is pro-American - ANY American.. He has said it, ad nauseum, for the past two years.. Groups can spin their preferred narrative any which way they want, but they are free to lie - facts do not..
    This is incorrect. His favorable are dropping, especially among white males. His base is shrinking.

    Be honest with yourself. Do you honestly think Trump can explain the Iran deal and why he wants to pull out. Do you honestly think the can explain what his EO for the insurance markets does and the impact it has? Do you honestly think he cares 1 bit about anyone other than himself and his rich buddies?

    If he's so pro American (any Ameircan) then why has he not helped Puerto Rico with the aide and support they need. Why hasn't he help California with the aide and support they need. Why have 4 soldiers been killed in Niger and he hasn't said a word about it? You have those Bengazhi hawks yelling and screaming for years, and not a peep from them. What was Trump doing when those bodies came back in coffins? He was golfing.
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  27. #1797  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSoundLady View Post
    That's exactly what the powers that be want you to think

    So the masses all think that Trump is stupid. And there he is, the President and one of the richest men in the country too.

    Trump comes across as stupid because his scripted persona requires him to. If he acts stupid, then the powers that be can get away with anything, which is either excused by - or distracted from by - more Trump loud-mouth stupidity.

    As if every last movement isn't carefully tailored and planned to make us think whatever it is we think.

    I don't expect anyone to agree with me. These people are a hell of a lot more convincing and all-encompassing than any lone voice that contradicts the narrative. That's why they keep winning and will always win it seems.
    This is ridiculous. You are honestly telling me that Trump has acted stupid for the past 30 years knowing that in 2017 he'd be elected President? My god.
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  28. #1798  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerrard-2005 View Post
    Typically, thought provoking, Vortigen, and the central premise is right in the respect that I can't fully understand another's experience if I haven't experienced it for myself - but this is the crux.. It isn't only blacks people that suffer discrimination.. lots of groups in society do..

    To give an example - what is the prevailing view of Scousers in the UK? - thieves, lazy, benefit scroungers.. Are some like that? - of course, but we all get tarred with the same brush no matter our personal circumstances.. do you not think it possible a potential employer would choose the non-Scouse candidate because he doesn't care for the accent or maybe believes the stereotypes?.. is this really much different from a Black candidate?.. the outcome would be the same.. do you see protest groups and affirmative action for poor Scousers who, due to nothing more than a generalisation, are negatively stereotyped?.. No, of course not - we get on with it.. You could apply this bias to just about any area of life - . Surely the offence is in the perception of the person offended?.. The Black versus White dichotomy is just another example of bias whether implicit or explicit, but it is not the only one, and for lots of people it wouldn't even be the most important one - but it gets the most attention and resources..

    It just seems to me that the politics of victimhood is poison - it affects everything it touches and the people who believe it become more entrenched in it every day, oftentimes despite the reality.. It doesn't offer any answers, just increasingly crazy demands like reparations and affirmative action which only serves to increase divisions..

    Back to the US - during his campaign, Trump said at every rally - no matter where it was or who was in attendance that he wanted to sort out the inner-cities, the ghettos, to give hope back to the good, law-abiding people that live there.. He gave positive examples of how that might be achieved - increased policing, better schools, more funding - if my memory serves me correctly he even created new roles and appointed people to the task.. He said it was a national scandal that theses areas (virtually all in Democrat strongholds) had been allowed to deteriorate in this way.. Now, how in the hell can anyone turn that into a Trump is racist narrative?.. What more could he have said or done?.. To my mind, the Democrats are the ones culpable for the race divide in the US - do they do it deliberately?.. There are a plethora of Black hosted YouTube channels that are disgusted with the policies of the Democrat authorities in these areas - I have not seen it personally so I can only take them at their word - one thing is for sure, I can't find any channels of Black folk saying these areas provide a positive life experience..

    So where does that leave us?.. Do you not think that the Black experience would be improved by sorting out these areas?.. Do you not think that the current image of the typical Black, male youth would change if he stayed at school, got a job, married his girlfriend and raised his children using himself as a positive role model?.. I understand slavery will always be the elephant in the room, but it will always be there, nobody can change history.. You can change your future though..

    The Birtherism debate is old news.. There was a genuine doubt as to Obama's place of birth, he spent large portions of his life outside of the US and given that the rules are very clear if one wants to become President of the United Sates, I think the queries were probably justified.. Sure, his race may have been a factor, but the fact that some conspiracy nuts are not satisfied is to be expected.. There are plenty of conspiracy nuts right now who believe that Trump is being controlled by Putin, or that he is a card-carrying member of the KKK, and even one that he enjoys golden showers from prostitutes at Moscow hotels.. Ban the internet, I say!..
    wow... just so much in this post. Just...
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    Quote Originally Posted by lfcstlouis View Post
    This is ridiculous. You are honestly telling me that Trump has acted stupid for the past 30 years knowing that in 2017 he'd be elected President? My god.
    Perhaps look at the results instead of the actions.

    Are the results currently being achieved what Trump wants?

    If so...how stupid is he really?
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  30. #1800  
    lfcstlouis is online now Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhoscoch View Post
    Perhaps look at the results instead of the actions.

    Are the results currently being achieved what Trump wants?

    If so...how stupid is he really?
    Incredibly stupid. Short term gains for long term losses. this won't end well for him or the people around him/party.
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