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Thread: Virgil Van Dijk Episode II - the rumour mill strikes back

  1. #2461  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MishMasch View Post
    Chuck em 70m and lets be done with it
    After the first 45 minutes against Watford, I think so.
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    Might sound a bit silly, but what is exactly the reason we don't submit a bid for van Dijk? What the hell are we waiting for? Are we scared of a transfer ban? So what? If Klopp doesn't want to sign anyone else anyway, what effect would it have anyway? I just don't get it.
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  3. #2463  
    Warten Auf 19 is online now Another New User Name
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    Van Dijk, Titus *********** Bramble or anyone in between. I'm beyond caring about who just sign someone.
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  4. #2464  
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    He is not that good and he is injured.

    Newcastle have bought a TOP TOP CB this summer.
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    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomsy13 View Post
    Might sound a bit silly, but what is exactly the reason we don't submit a bid for van Dijk? What the hell are we waiting for? Are we scared of a transfer ban? So what? If Klopp doesn't want to sign anyone else anyway, what effect would it have anyway? I just don't get it.
    Thomsy my friend I don't think anyone really knows what's going on with us at the moment. We don't know who to apportion blame to FSG or Klopp. We are supposedly to have all this money available, but nobody except two players are good enough to spend it on. He doesn't do defense because he thinks he can score enough goals to make up for it.

    I don't believe in the 200mill or any other hundred mill sum we have to spend, and there are a lot of questions that Klopp should have to answer.
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    Warten Auf 19 is online now Another New User Name
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
    Yes, he is right but we still need a CB.
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  8. #2468  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
    Absolutely. Sorry but Klopp doesn't convince me at all. Won't mention what I'd like to see quite yet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
    I don't agree with Carra on this one. We have defenders who were not very good defenders before they joined us either (except maybe Matip) and it should come as no surprise to anyone that they hardly got any better in a more expansive, more attacking setup. If anything, it would make us a much worse side if we get more defensive as you could see in the last 15 minutes of the game. Invite pressure on a defence - and midfield in our case- that contains defenders who are not really good defenders and a total disaster happens. If this team wore a Man United or a Chelsea shirt, the result would be the same. Needless to say, non of our defenders would get anywhere near our rivals' starting eleven though.

    Oh and just a thought, bit of a deja vu. I remember when people said in Rodgers' last full season that our setup and coahces are all wrong for defending, when in fact the likes of Moreno,Manquillo,Skrtel and Can as a make shift defender should be more than good enough to challenge for a title. Well i guess time has proved them all wrong. It was probably nothing to do with Rodgers, rather the personnel he had at his disposal.

    I always said that i thought Rodgers was a good enough coach, he just messed up his transfers all the time. I can't see much of a difference between him and Klopp at the moment with the exception that Klopp at least doesn't waste money. Not sure it makes us any better though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warten Auf 19 View Post
    Yes, he is right but we still need a CB.
    I agree that they can be upgraded, but people need to realise that we are still going to be defensively fragile.

    You might think that VVD being in our back line today would have made the difference in terms of personnel, but I feel that not having a creative midfielder is what cost us.

    With the way we play, when we have a dominant midfielder on the pitch, dictating play, the opposition usually see less of the ball, they'll sit deeper, and they'll fail to bypass our midfield. Not to mention we usually create even more chances.

    Obviously changing our defensive system is the real answer, but my point is that sometimes, if your not scoring, it isn't because you having a strikers problem, and when you're conceding goals it isn't always a defenders problem.
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
    He's right isn't he. A new CB is just getting thrown into the lions den.
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B-xdt0kddoQ
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  12. #2472  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    I agree that they can be upgraded, but people need to realise that we are still going to be defensively fragile.

    You might think that VVD being in our back line today would have made the difference in terms of personnel, but I feel that not having a creative midfielder is what cost us.

    With the way we play, when we have a dominant midfielder on the pitch, dictating play, the opposition usually see less of the ball, they'll sit deeper, and they'll fail to bypass our midfield. Not to mention we usually create even more chances.

    Obviously changing our defensive system is the real answer, but my point is that sometimes, if your not scoring, it isn't because you having a strikers problem, and when you're conceding goals it isn't always a defenders problem.
    It's nothing new, we don't have any leaders on the pitch, it's a problem both in midfield and in our defence as well. That's why a player like van Dijk would be such an upgrade.
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  13. #2473  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    People need to check what Carragher said after the game. He believes that our system is wrong for defending, which causes the problems, and feels that our defensive woes would essentially continue with a top defensive signing. I'm inclined to agree.
    Get rid of zonal marking for starters, not working persisting with it, try man to man marking and see if that helps.

    Klopp being stubborn and not willing to try that by the looks of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomsy13 View Post
    I don't agree with Carra on this one. We have defenders who were not very good defenders before they joined us either (except maybe Matip) and it should come as no surprise to anyone that they hardly got any better in a more expansive, more attacking setup. If anything, it would make us a much worse side if we get more defensive as you could see in the last 15 minutes of the game. Invite pressure on a defence - and midfield in our case- that contains defenders who are not really good defenders and a total disaster happens. If this team wore a Man United or a Chelsea shirt, the result would be the same. Needless to say, non of our defenders would get anywhere near our rivals' starting eleven though.

    Oh and just a though, bit of a deja vu. I remember when people said in Rodgers' last full season that our setup and coahces are all wrong for defending, when in fact the likes of Moreno,Manquillo,Skrtel and Can as a make shift defender should be more than good enough to challenge for a title. Well i guess time has proved them all wrong. It was probably nothing to do with Rodgers, rather the personnel he had at his disposal.

    I always said that i thought Rodgers was a good enough coach, he just messed up his transfers all the time. I can't see much of a difference between him and Klopp at the moment with the exception that Klopp at least doesn't waste money. Not sure it makes us any better though.
    Look, Lovren isn't the best, but he's better than what we make out. He was good at Southampton. Sakho was good at Crystal Palace and when I've seen him play for France.

    When Carragher talks about a better defensive setup, it doesn't mean that we just sit deep, but it does mean better defensive structure. There's a way to control a game when you're out of possession, not just in possession.
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    Quote Originally Posted by redfoot View Post
    Absolutely. Sorry but Klopp doesn't convince me at all. Won't mention what I'd like to see quite yet.

    Klopp works in such a way that he really does require players with a particular skill set. Had Lallana played today instead of either Henderson or Can I feel that we would have got the win, and dominated in style, but that one player being absent affected everything. We saw this last season; having 4 creative players on the pitch, with one of them playing deeper, makes all the difference.

    Your top teams operate with Even more than that. Look at Bayern, Barcelona, Real Madrid. Klopp likes to play attacking football, and I respect that, but he needs that creative presence centrally as well. I'm not surprised he went all out for Keita, when you watch how he plays.
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    Look, Lovren isn't the best, but he's better than what we make out. He was good at Southampton. Sakho was good at Crystal Palace and when I've seen him play for France.

    When Carragher talks about a better defensive setup, it doesn't mean that we just sit deep, but it does mean better defensive structure. There's a way to control a game when you're out of possession, not just in possession.
    Not really. Lovren is UTTER CRAP. One of the worst defenders I have seen playing for us. He is awful. But Moreno is miles worse. He IS the worst defender that have ever played for us.
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  17. #2477  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    Look, Lovren isn't the best, but he's better than what we make out. He was good at Southampton. Sakho was good at Crystal Palace and when I've seen him play for France.

    When Carragher talks about a better defensive setup, it doesn't mean that we just sit deep, but it does mean better defensive structure. There's a way to control a game when you're out of possession, not just in possession.
    Not disagreeing with you but the thing is that if we have lots of players like that- good, but not very good- then you get where we stand now. Definitely not good enough to challenge for the title, probably not good enough to get into the Champions league, but certainly good enough to be among the top 7-8 best teams in the league.

    That's the thing we might just have to accept as a Liverpool fan- with this ownership- that we should be content with a top4 finish in every 4-5 years, we should be content with losing our best player whenever we have a good-ish season, and then incosistent results won't come as a surprise. That was the horrible thing in this Watford draw as well, i didn't really expect us to win this game even before kick off. Not because we are a worse team than Watford- we are certainly not-, but because over the course of a season this team won't produce good enough results to challenge for the title. And it's because we don't have the right personnel for it. Be it a brain fart in defence, a bad day in the office in midfield or missing glorious chances in front of goal. Non of it matters.

    We saw a team last season that barely got 4th spot without any European and cup football as an added burden, so people shouldn't really be surprised if results will be worse than last season with more football, especially if we lose our best player. We need signings, ones that are better than what we already have. That's the only way we can change our results. Nothing to do with practicing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warten Auf 19 View Post
    Yes, he is right but we still need a CB.
    We need two. Both of today's CB's are good on their day. But generally both are ordinary defenders. Don't know why people rave about Matip, he is no better than Lovren.
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    They did not like Sakho, because he is on high wages.

    Sakho is a World Class CB. Lovren is utter crap. Garbage.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevo0573 View Post
    We need two. Both of today's CB's are good on their day. But generally both are ordinary defenders. Don't know why people rave about Matip, he is no better than Lovren.
    Matip still needs to prove himself, I'd say there isn't much between the trio of Matip, Lovren and Sakho but Klavan and Gomez are a big step down. Since we don't want to use Sakho we need another CB, it has nothing to do with what Carra said, I agree with him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gio View Post
    They did not like Sakho, because he is on high wages.

    Sakho is a World Class CB. Lovren is utter crap. Garbage.
    Not sure if serious.
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  22. #2482  
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    Look, Lovren isn't the best, but he's better than what we make out. He was good at Southampton. Sakho was good at Crystal Palace and when I've seen him play for France.

    When Carragher talks about a better defensive setup, it doesn't mean that we just sit deep, but it does mean better defensive structure. There's a way to control a game when you're out of possession, not just in possession.
    I'm sorry but he just wasn't and I don't know why some people keep saying this. He was part of a defence that shipped nearly as many goals as us that season and we let in fifty! (Southampton 46)
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    new day,still no news that we put out an offer:FP:
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo1122 View Post
    Look, Lovren isn't the best, but he's better than what we make out. He was good at Southampton. Sakho was good at Crystal Palace and when I've seen him play for France.

    When Carragher talks about a better defensive setup, it doesn't mean that we just sit deep, but it does mean better defensive structure. There's a way to control a game when you're out of possession, not just in possession.
    fonte was the good man in saints.we got the wrong guy
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  25. #2485  
    Mouldiogs is online now Wants a little line under his title
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    Van Dijk and Handanovic would make a massive difference.
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  26. #2486  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gio View Post
    They did not like Sakho, because he is on high wages.

    Sakho is a World Class CB. Lovren is utter crap. Garbage.
    World class my ass he's mediocre and far more erratic than Lovren.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mihamiha23 View Post
    fonte was the good man in saints.we got the wrong guy
    Yeah, he's been excellent for West Ham...
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  28. #2488  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouldiogs View Post
    World class my ass he's mediocre and far more erratic than Lovren.
    Sakho's positional sense is much better than Lovren's.

    Lovren's today was terrible and so was Matip's, Lovren is the type of defender that doesn't want to clear danger, he just leaves it for next guy.

    He's a spineless defender, Klopp seems to be a believer in people not their actual ability.
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    Quote Originally Posted by +Shriekback+ View Post
    Sakho's positional sense is much better than Lovren's.

    Lovren's today was terrible and so was Matip's, Lovren is the type of defender that doesn't want to clear danger, he just leaves it for next guy.

    He's a spineless defender, Klopp seems to be a believer in people not their actual ability.
    I've never been Sakho's biggest fan, but he was extremely good when Klopp first arrived, I thought he really turned a corner. Shame he got that injury, who knows what might have become of him had he kicked on from that start.
    'Okey doke, we'll leave it there so'
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  30. #2490  
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    Quote Originally Posted by +Shriekback+ View Post
    Sakho's positional sense is much better than Lovren's.

    Lovren's today was terrible and so was Matip's, Lovren is the type of defender that doesn't want to clear danger, he just leaves it for next guy.

    He's a spineless defender, Klopp seems to be a believer in people not their actual ability.
    Odd games but in general he's all over the place and takes 4 or 5 games after each injury to be decent again and then another injury. Lovren and Matip have a good record playing together.
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