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Thread: How good is our attack?

  1. #61  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by wearethereds93 View Post
    make him captain, improve the defence, get keita bedded in and we can win things, he can lead us to a trophy or two
    yeah thats the way also get emre nailed down to a contract

    also think ox will improve the more he settles.

    biggest thing this summer is to resist what happened to monaco last year happening to us this summer.


    saying **** off to all bids for our front 4
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  2. #62  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedGhana View Post
    more or less feel the same.

    wouldn't put arsenal in that category, would put them a level below us attacking wise, spurs too. their attacks seem to be more rigid with a specific

    focal point in lacazette and kane - both attacks are set up generally to have these 2 finish them. both kane and lacazette aren`t that capable of drifting

    and interchanging across the front 3 / front 4 like our 4 - even though both are clearly superior finishers to firmino.



    With our 4 they are all as adept as each other at interchanging across the whole front 3/4 either finishing or creating at more or less the same high

    level and its beautiful to watch. Someone like lacazette is a class finisher but is so boring to watch when hes not finishing off a move. similar to

    kane to a certain extent.

    with out front 4 you just never know what youre gonna get at any second - anything is possible at any second - sexy football
    the one thing city s attack has over us is age

    sane sterling jesus are barely there yet. they havent even hit their prime yet. our lads are all in their prime.

    city s attack will be phenomenal in 2-3 years but its pretty devastating as is
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredthecamel View Post
    yeah thats the way also get emre nailed down to a contract

    also think ox will improve the more he settles.

    biggest thing this summer is to resist what happened to monaco last year happening to us this summer.


    saying **** off to all bids for our front 4
    I agree

    having a midfield and forward line up of;

    ------can----------Keita

    Salah------Coutinho(C)-------Mane

    ---------Firmino------------

    Would be very strong
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    Minutes per goal/assists so far this season, all competitions:
    Coutinho - 66
    Salah - 75
    Mane - 93
    Firmino - 96
    And, on the bench, apparently not fitting in at all with the way we play these days, Sturridge - 86

    That's just ridiculous...but imagine what we could do if we had a proper finisher in there:

    Gomez-Matip-VVD
    Can-Keita
    Salah-Firmino-Coutinho-Mane
    Aubameyang

    Good night.
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  5. #65  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    Minutes per goal/assists so far this season, all competitions:
    Coutinho - 66
    Salah - 75
    Mane - 93
    Firmino - 96
    And, on the bench, apparently not fitting in at all with the way we play these days, Sturridge - 86

    That's just ridiculous...but imagine what we could do if we had a proper finisher in there:

    Gomez-Matip-VVD
    Can-Keita
    Salah-Firmino-Coutinho-Mane
    Aubameyang

    Good night.
    thats a proper looking defense too....wouldnt wanna burden salah with such defensive responsibilities but gomez matip vvd as our 3 man cbs looks very solid
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedGhana View Post
    more or less feel the same.

    wouldn't put arsenal in that category, would put them a level below us attacking wise, spurs too. their attacks seem to be more rigid with a specific

    focal point in lacazette and kane - both attacks are set up generally to have these 2 finish them. both kane and lacazette aren`t that capable of drifting

    and interchanging across the front 3 / front 4 like our 4 - even though both are clearly superior finishers to firmino.



    With our 4 they are all as adept as each other at interchanging across the whole front 3/4 either finishing or creating at more or less the same high

    level and its beautiful to watch. Someone like lacazette is a class finisher but is so boring to watch when hes not finishing off a move. similar to

    kane to a certain extent.

    with out front 4 you just never know what youre gonna get at any second - anything is possible at any second - sexy football
    Kane is more prolific than Firmino, but let's be honest, he's nowhere near as intelligent. Kane on an intelligence scale rivals Lukaku whereas Firmino is in on an Aguero level when it comes to intelligence. A lot of our fans cannot see how intelligent Firmino is.

    As for the free-kick at the week-end. Coutinho did what Ray Kennedy used to. During team-talks they used to discuss tactical stuff. Out of all they players, they knew 100% Ray Kennedy was listening. He would execute what was discussed on the pitch. All Phil did was execute what was discussed. That shows real intelligence.
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  7. #67  
    steviewonder87 is online now Academy prospect
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredthecamel View Post
    yeah thats the way also get emre nailed down to a contract

    also think ox will improve the more he settles.

    biggest thing this summer is to resist what happened to monaco last year happening to us this summer.



    saying **** off to all bids for our front 4
    The amount of quality players they've sold in recent years is astounding; Yaya Toure, James Rodriguez, Carrasco, Kondogbia, Martial, then last season Bakayoko, Mendy, Mbappe and Silva. Their scouts and academy are up there with the best in the world, they really are just a conveyor belt for talent.

    They really struggled this year in the CL though, and probably Lemar and Fabinho will be the next ones to go, then Tielemans in a few years. But no doubt they'll find more quality to replace them with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredthecamel View Post
    thats a proper looking defense too....wouldnt wanna burden salah with such defensive responsibilities but gomez matip vvd as our 3 man cbs looks very solid
    I don't really expect us to go that way, but it doesn't look completely crazy. And sure, opponents might think they can get at our wingbacks - but would you want to leave them space in behind you?
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  9. #69  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    I don't really expect us to go that way, but it doesn't look completely crazy. And sure, opponents might think they can get at our wingbacks - but would you want to leave them space in behind you?
    if they were all n our squad with ox and robertson to be used as wingbacks against stronger sides it doesnt look crazy at all

    that line up would tonk most park the bussers at home and away

    i m expecting a 4-2-3-1 stable base in midfield and front four go party with support from wide areas and one of the midfield 2 or maybe both in tandem and two strong pacy centre backs to cope with counter attacks and aerial threats

    we have a goalkeeper with quick distribution in karius once he irons out a few errors.. have to say it all looks a bit rosy today.

    there s potentially a very dominant side in the making.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    I don't really expect us to go that way, but it doesn't look completely crazy. And sure, opponents might think they can get at our wingbacks - but would you want to leave them space in behind you?
    For the life of me I cannot see Klopp going with a back 3 on a long term basis. He only did at the weekend because he had no choice.
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    steviewonder87 is online now Academy prospect
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    I don't really expect us to go that way, but it doesn't look completely crazy. And sure, opponents might think they can get at our wingbacks - but would you want to leave them space in behind you?
    But you're forgetting the key component in your line up. The driving force, the man they all turn to, the one who makes it all tick, the unsung hero.

    -------Migs-------
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  12. #72  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by steviewonder87 View Post
    The amount of quality players they've sold in recent years is astounding; Yaya Toure, James Rodriguez, Carrasco, Kondogbia, Martial, then last season Bakayoko, Mendy, Mbappe and Silva. Their scouts and academy are up there with the best in the world, they really are just a conveyor belt for talent.

    They really struggled this year in the CL though, and probably Lemar and Fabinho will be the next ones to go, then Tielemans in a few years. But no doubt they'll find more quality to replace them with.
    yeah but they ll be up and down meantime

    and how long til they wrestlke another title from psg

    our front four go tonking sides like that in europe and the likes of real barca psg will come knocking for our players... resist , must resist if they want to build a lasting dynasty and knock those *********** mancs off their perch
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  13. #73  
    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by steviewonder87 View Post
    But you're forgetting the key component in your line up. The driving force, the man they all turn to, the one who makes it all tick, the unsung hero.

    -------Migs-------
    it ll be karius with quick distriubtion to our pacy widemen for super quick counters... he made a very bad decision to come out for one ball last night( but he s only a baby in goalkeeping terms) but that aside his concentration held up well in a night when he had little to do really
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    Quote Originally Posted by steviewonder87 View Post
    The amount of quality players they've sold in recent years is astounding; Yaya Toure, James Rodriguez, Carrasco, Kondogbia, Martial, then last season Bakayoko, Mendy, Mbappe and Silva. Their scouts and academy are up there with the best in the world, they really are just a conveyor belt for talent.

    They really struggled this year in the CL though, and probably Lemar and Fabinho will be the next ones to go, then Tielemans in a few years. But no doubt they'll find more quality to replace them with.
    They've done what I had thought we were maybe going to try - they've consistently targeted the best 19-20-21 year olds, and played them in a style/system that suits. As such they've established themselves as an excellent choice for quality footballers of that age.

    It's difficult to sustain though - this summer looked a really poor show from them, letting so many big players leave, but perhaps that is crucial to their ability to sign those players in the first place?

    How do you break the cycle, without also breaking the conveyor belt?
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    fredthecamel is online now First team regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    They've done what I had thought we were maybe going to try - they've consistently targeted the best 19-20-21 year olds, and played them in a style/system that suits. As such they've established themselves as an excellent choice for quality footballers of that age.

    It's difficult to sustain though - this summer looked a really poor show from them, letting so many big players leave, but perhaps that is crucial to their ability to sign those players in the first place?

    How do you break the cycle, without also breaking the conveyor belt?
    they let too many go last summer and will let a couple go this summer.... they must be making a fortune on transfers.. which helps as they have no gate moneys really
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    They've done what I had thought we were maybe going to try - they've consistently targeted the best 19-20-21 year olds, and played them in a style/system that suits. As such they've established themselves as an excellent choice for quality footballers of that age.

    It's difficult to sustain though - this summer looked a really poor show from them, letting so many big players leave, but perhaps that is crucial to their ability to sign those players in the first place?

    How do you break the cycle, without also breaking the conveyor belt?
    I don't think they particularly care about breaking their 'cycle' tbh. Think they're happy to churn out young players and sell them for massive profits and have the odd season of success when it all comes together (last season), then rinse repeat. If they had any intentions of dethroning PSG they would have either kept hold of Mbappe or sold him abroad, selling him to them after his first breakthrough season (with the whole loan for a year thing doing them a massive favour) indicated to me they don't really have ambitions of playing anything other than second fiddle to PSG. It's kind of similar to Dortmund actually.
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    Quote Originally Posted by steviewonder87 View Post
    I don't think they particularly care about breaking their 'cycle' tbh. Think they're happy to churn out young players and sell them for massive profits and have the odd season of success when it all comes together (last season), then rinse repeat. If they had any intentions of dethroning PSG they would have either kept hold of Mbappe or sold him abroad, selling him to them after his first breakthrough season (with the whole loan for a year thing doing them a massive favour) indicated to me they don't really have ambitions of playing anything other than second fiddle to PSG. It's kind of similar to Dortmund actually.
    I don't think it's as simple as that.

    What are 'little' Monaco supposed to do when City and PSG - the two richest clubs in world football - want their players?

    Ok, they might have been able to hang onto one or two for another season, but it's surely only delaying the inevitable.

    It'll be interesting to see what they do with the Mbappe money - it would be almost impossible to spend it all using their current approach. But what good is money in the bank? I'd be surprised if their model is designed around giving their owners huge dividends or stockpiling cash.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    I don't think it's as simple as that.

    What are 'little' Monaco supposed to do when City and PSG - the two richest clubs in world football - want their players?

    Ok, they might have been able to hang onto one or two for another season, but it's surely only delaying the inevitable.

    It'll be interesting to see what they do with the Mbappe money - it would be almost impossible to spend it all using their current approach. But what good is money in the bank? I'd be surprised if their model is designed around giving their owners huge dividends or stockpiling cash.
    But they could have sold him abroad, PSG were hardly the only club interested in him and they don't even have to pay for him for a year, and it's not like Monaco need the money. Selling him to their (only) direct rival was just suicide. He's not just a quality player like Mendy, Silva, etc. either, he's the brightest young talent in the world right now and a future Balon d'Or winner I think.
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    our front four go tonking sides like that in europe and the likes of real barca psg will come knocking for our players... resist , must resist if they want to build a lasting dynasty and knock those *********** mancs off their perch[/QUOTE]

    That's what I've been saying. Instead of selling our exceptional player's, let's bully other clubs and take theirs. Why should we sell our best players when clubs like Chelsea and City don't have to. We're a considerably bigger club than both.

    Let's build what Bill Shankly once said 'a bastion of invincibility' and what Bob Paisley did build 'a well oiled machine'. Let's get 21 before United and make their lives a living hell.
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    lfcstlouis is offline Caution advised, may not be actual saint
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    So, who can we buy with the 325M we'll get in the summer for Salah and Coutinho?

    Lemar, Auba, and 2 CB's?
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    Quote Originally Posted by steviewonder87 View Post
    But they could have sold him abroad, PSG were hardly the only club interested in him and they don't even have to pay for him for a year, and it's not like Monaco need the money. Selling him to their (only) direct rival was just suicide. He's not just a quality player like Mendy, Silva, etc. either, he's the brightest young talent in the world right now and a future Balon d'Or winner I think.
    The loan element makes it questionable, but I think the player was keen on PSG and they just blew other suitors out.

    It's all very well to say anyone but PSG, but forcing that through is not necessarily easy or even possible.

    We're a lot bigger than Monaco but even we've lost out to Chelsea (Torres) and City (Sterling). Was that because we had no real interest in trying to grow?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    The loan element makes it questionable, but I think the player was keen on PSG and they just blew other suitors out.

    It's all very well to say anyone but PSG, but forcing that through is not necessarily easy or even possible.

    We're a lot bigger than Monaco but even we've lost out to Chelsea (Torres) and City (Sterling). Was that because we had no real interest in trying to grow?
    Isn't it purely because we cannot pay the wages those clubs pay?
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    Quote Originally Posted by lfcstlouis View Post
    So, who can we buy with the 325M we'll get in the summer for Salah and Coutinho?

    Lemar, Auba, and 2 CB's?
    Firstly that's irrelevant because we're selling neither. Secondly I reckon that the owners will back Klopp on any signing provided the selling club is prepared to sell. If he wants two centre backs...he'll get two centre backs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kloppsstars View Post
    Firstly that's irrelevant because we're selling neither. Secondly I reckon that the owners will back Klopp on any signing provided the selling club is prepared to sell. If he wants two centre backs...he'll get two centre backs.
    We're just as likely to sell as not sell. So who knows. But I do agree FSG will back Klopp. Hopefully he has more than 1 player her wants.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thebeastyboy View Post
    Isn't it purely because we cannot pay the wages those clubs pay?
    No, not just that. I'd say both left at least as much in search of trophies as money. And both were vindicated in that respect.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lfcstlouis View Post
    We're just as likely to sell as not sell. So who knows. But I do agree FSG will back Klopp. Hopefully he has more than 1 player her wants.
    We're not likely to sell as not sell. That's the defeatist attitude I was talking about. Liverpool have no need to sell and don't want to sell either. Selling does one thing and one thing only, it shows an overall lack of ambition. Why on earth should they make other clubs stronger? If Liverpool want to topple City and smash Gaurdiolas face in, we need to add to not lose our best players.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    No, not just that. I'd say both left at least as much in search of trophies as money. And both were vindicated in that respect.
    Fair enough
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    steviewonder87 is online now Academy prospect
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    The loan element makes it questionable, but I think the player was keen on PSG and they just blew other suitors out.

    It's all very well to say anyone but PSG, but forcing that through is not necessarily easy or even possible.

    We're a lot bigger than Monaco but even we've lost out to Chelsea (Torres) and City (Sterling). Was that because we had no real interest in trying to grow?
    I don't think Mbappe would have taken too much convincing to make the move to someone like Barca or Real (even in a year or 2), he'd only just broken into the first team and suddenly he's calling the shots? I don't know, just seems like they didn't even bother putting up a fight.

    I did think about Torres and Sterling actually, but ignoring the differing circumstances (our owners at the time, contract situations, etc), we at least reinvested all the money almost immediately, and I don't think we'd do that again with where we are now. We refused outright to do that with Suarez and I imagine we'd do the same with Coutinho if a PL team were interested. Selling Phil to Barca is obviously not desirable but selling him to someone like City? That would be unthinkable. Like I said before, it reminds me of Dortmund; build a great side, have some success (win a title, do well in the CL) then get picked apart and their best players poached by their richer direct rival. Atletico are also similar, but they rarely sell their key players to Barca or Real, they almost always go abroad. I mean at the end of the day smaller teams will always lose their better players to bigger teams, it's just the way of the world, but strengthening your main rival in the process just doesn't sit well with me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kloppsstars View Post
    We're not likely to sell as not sell. That's the defeatist attitude I was talking about. Liverpool have no need to sell and don't want to sell either. Selling does one thing and one thing only, it shows an overall lack of ambition. Why on earth should they make other clubs stronger? If Liverpool want to topple City and smash Gaurdiolas face in, we need to add to not lose our best players.
    Sometimes it doesn't matter what Liverpool want. there are 2 other sides to this coin.

    You think Barca wanted to sell Neymar? I'm saying every player has their price. Some clubs are willing to meet that price. Not defeatist, mind. I'm quite optimistic in all of this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ***Stuzzza*** View Post
    No, not just that. I'd say both left at least as much in search of trophies as money. And both were vindicated in that respect.
    Torres left because the previous owners were taking us nowhere and replaced a tactical genius with a very poor manager who was also a 'puppet'. It would have been like replacing Bob Paisley with Ron Atkinson. Sterling left for one thing and one thing only....money.
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